Kraton Best Motor, Electronics Combo For Kraton 6s EXB

[Don Pots]

If anyone is interested in cool running no thermal cut off insane performance from their Kraton EXB this is it. Standing wheelies with a double pump of the throttle at full speed. I'm guessing 70+ MPH but haven't tested it. All Rick Bobby knows is its fast and makes me curse! Here are my costs as well so you know what you're getting into. This is a list from starting with nothing.

My Project costs:
469.99 Kraton EXB
69.95 Traxxas Tool Kit
139.95 Reefs Raw 500 Servo (Insane waterproof programable torque)
27.99 Work Stand
150.00 G.e.n.s Ace Bashing Series 6800mAh 22.2V 120C 6S1P Lipo Battery Pack (120C! Heavy but awesome) (Annoying that I have to be creative so this algorithm doesn't say gens-ace-r-spam Spammers when I post the thread. This should be changed forum admins.
11.95 RPM Mamba ESC Cage (Only used the switch holder, the rest won't fit in the 6s)
10.99 IC5 Connectors
300.00 Castle Mamba X8s/1520-1650KV Motor/ESC Combo (No thermal cutoff after using whole battery at top speed, low KV means cooler temps and more torque. High pinion tooth count for speed)
16.99 20Tooth Mod1 Arrma Pinion Gear (Great speed/torque balance)
10.00 Solder Labor (My irons are in storage in a different state )
10.49 IC5 Extension Cable
12.99 Lipo Safety Sack
149.99 Lipo Charger
7.70 300mm Sensor Wire
54.99 SR315 D Receiver
121.12 DX5c Transmitter only (Got a deal on Amazon)
3.98 Velcro Cable Ties
7.90 3M double sided 8” Sheet (Use 3M 5952 VHB tape) It's better than screws. Had to shave down the lip on the plastic mount to fit Mamba X8s.
11.00 Castle B-Link (For in the field adjustments on my iPhone. Allows for cheaper receiver and transmitter. I only use a 3 channel receiver which also gives a AUX channel for a specific function you use often to be programmed to a button on the transmitter like throttle speed if you want to hand off to someone who is inexperienced with the power.)

Sub Total: $1587.97

Tax:
35.77
12.15
11.13
31.33
1.12
4.14
8.02
.52

Tax Sub Total: $104.18

Total: $1692.15

 

[hobo]

just need to put a decent chassis on it now

 

[Engineer]

Just curious - why the 1520 over a 1717?

 

[Sargent_Horse]

Just curious - why the 1520 over a 1717?

I was just about to ask the same thing. The 1717 shouldn't have any issues fitting in the K6S and would have better torque.

 

[Don Pots]

just need to put a decent chassis on it now

I like the outcast body better. I wonder if I can make it fit?

Just curious - why the 1520 over a 1717?

Castle Creations offers this new motor/Mamba X8s combo for 1/8 and 1/5th scale which is smaller in diameter but longer then the 1717 which makes it easier for fit especially if one wanted to add fans. It has roughly the same power as the 1717 if you check out their description but runs cooler with less KVs. Slap a high pinion on there and you have speed and power! I run the 20tooth.

I was just about to ask the same thing. The 1717 shouldn't have any issues fitting in the K6S and would have better torque.

Just curious - why the 1520 over a 1717?

As a engineer you know that loss of heat means loss of power. The 1520-1650 motor runs cooler with roughly the same power. Go to the site and read on this combo. It’s a new combo.

 

[Dan B.]

$70.00 for a Traxxas tool kit? Three letters…..MIP

 

[Engineer]

As a engineer you know that loss of heat means loss of power. The 1520-1650 motor runs cooler with roughly the same power. Go to the site and read on this combo. It’s a new combo.

OK. From Castle, the intention of the 1520 was to fit use cases where a smaller diameter motor was a necessity but that the 1717 was better due to more torque.

https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/...-combo-w-1520-motor-1650kv.31313/#post-434143

I’m not a big block Castle user, I have some of their stuff for my crawlers but I took a look at the ad copy of both the 1520 and 1717 MMX8s combos and they both say them same thing with regard to temperature. Where are you seeing specs that the 1520 runs cooler?

 

[Don Pots]

OK. From Castle, the intention of the 1520 was to fit use cases where a smaller diameter motor was a necessity but that the 1717 was better due to more torque.

https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/...-combo-w-1520-motor-1650kv.31313/#post-434143

I’m not a big block Castle user, I have some of their stuff for my crawlers but I took a look at the ad copy of both the 1520 and 1717 MMX8s combos and they both say them same thing with regard to temperature. Where are you seeing specs that the 1520 runs cooler?

OK. From Castle, the intention of the 1520 was to fit use cases where a smaller diameter motor was a necessity but that the 1717 was better due to more torque.

https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/...-combo-w-1520-motor-1650kv.31313/#post-434143

I’m not a big block Castle user, I have some of their stuff for my crawlers but I took a look at the ad copy of both the 1520 and 1717 MMX8s combos and they both say them same thing with regard to temperature. Where are you seeing specs that the 1520 runs cooler?

Well here is what they wrote on their page:

“Experience higher efficiency, advanced features and improved optimization for your stock upgrade or build with Castle’s legendary brushless power. The MAMBA MONSTER X 8S, 33.6V ESC W/1520-1650KV SENSORED COMBO is a perfect upgrade for 1/8, 1/7 and 1/6 scale vehicles weighing up to 18lbs and up to 8S LiPo. The 1520-1650Kv has all of the secret sauce that the big brother 1717-1650Kv has, but in a more compact diameter, fitting into smaller spaces without modifications to your chassis.”

“A low Kv motor has more winds of thinner wire—it will carry more volts at fewer amps, produce higher torque, and swing a bigger prop. A high Kv motor has fewer winds of thicker wire that carry more amps at fewer volts and spin a smaller prop at high revolutions.”

Well my interpretation is a lower KV will produce less heat in relation to a higher pinion tooth count. It’s well documented that heat is a issue when you go with a high KV# meaning the closer you get to or over 2k and a high tooth pinion. I would surmise that finding the sweet spot is essential with the two. Higher tooth or lower tooth in relation to the motor KV. Regardless maybe this motor is lighter? IDK. In the end my hand to god when I say this thing is insane but the KV ratio to pinion teeth also has great drivability wheeling when I want. This clip in the pic almost touches and would definitely the larger diameter 1717.

 

[jondilly1974]

OK. From Castle, the intention of the 1520 was to fit use cases where a smaller diameter motor was a necessity but that the 1717 was better due to more torque.

https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/...-combo-w-1520-motor-1650kv.31313/#post-434143

I’m not a big block Castle user, I have some of their stuff for my crawlers but I took a look at the ad copy of both the 1520 and 1717 MMX8s combos and they both say them same thing with regard to temperature. Where are you seeing specs that the 1520 runs cooler?

Runs cooler is not something I’ve heard before but it could be more surface area on the can?

 

[Don Pots]

Runs cooler is not something I’ve heard before but it could be more surface area on the can?

Added some more info to the above post

 

[jkflow]

Wow, could easily save $300 for equal or better performance but not knocking your setup.
Tools, servo and lipo are big saving opportunities, with equal or better performance, just not the bling factor.

Looks sweet and hope you have a lot of fun with it.

 

[Engineer]

Runs cooler is not something I’ve heard before but it could be more surface area on the can?

Just using a basic surface area of a cylinder formula, the 1717 actually has more surface area than the 1520… I’m genuinely curious if it is documented somewhere that it runs cooler given the same conditions.

 

[jr744]

$70.00 for a Traxxas tool kit? Three letters…..MIP

Amen! Preach on brotha!!

 

[Don Pots]

$70.00 for a Traxxas tool kit? Three letters…..MIP

It's a good tool kit. At this point saving a a few bucks is a drop in the bucket.

Wow, could easily save $300 for equal or better performance but not knocking your setup.
Tools, servo and lipo are big saving opportunities, with equal or better performance, just not the bling factor.

Looks sweet and hope you have a lot of fun with it.

Thanks....Sure you probably could find cheaper tools but this kit is 1 handle with normal drill bit size ends which includes nut drivers, Alan bits and wrenches. Performance with the Reefs servo I doubt it. It's a waterproof tank that isn't noisy at all like many other brands plus is programable. I'm genuinely interested in what your idea of better performance is? Torque rating? Speed? Reefs is hard to beat. I really am curious as to what you would choose that would save $300?

Features:

• Waterproof design
• CNC Raw Aluminum
• Steel internal gears
• BEC Not Required, Recommended

Specifications:
Internal: Steel Gears /CNC Aluminum Casing
Anodized Color: Raw
Bearing Type: 2BB
Weight: 2.75oz
Dimension: 1.57 x .79 x 1.5 (LWH)
Torque: 450oz @6.0v /500oz @7.4v /565oz @8.4v
Speed: .11sec @6.0v /.095sec @7.4v /.08sec @8.4v
Spline: 25T /Dead Band Width: 2¦Ìs
BEC: Not Required, Recommended

What other single 6s battery beats a 120C rating? Also, it's in-between a hard and soft case which I haven't seen done with anyone else. I'm not interested in a 2 battery setup. This fits perfect with no fuss or gaps.

 

[Jerry-rigged]

G.e.n.s Ace Bashing Series 6800mAh 22.2V 120C 6S1P Lipo Battery Pack (120C! Heavy but awesome) (Annoying that I have to be creative so this algorithm doesn't say gens-ace-r-spam Spammers when I post the thread. This should be changed forum admins.

Considering Admin set that rule due to Spamming, I doubt they will change it...

What other single 6s battery beats a 120C rating?

Do you want an Actual 120C rating (that is, a True, Continuous 816 amp output capacity), or a sticker that says "Actual 120C!!1! OMGBBQ!!" Cuz lots of brands have 120c, 150c, 200c or whatever printed on the label. But actual load testing shows they are all a lie, as the BEST hobby grade lipos are around 55c (last time I checked, anyway)

Bedtime reading -
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?1767093-Battery-Load-Test-Comparisons

But, overall, nice pricing breakdown on a great truck! Shows what it takes to get into the hobby with a OP setup. I have been eyeing that motor myself for my Outcast.

 

[Don Pots]

Considering Admin set that rule due to Spamming, I doubt they will change it...



Do you want an Actual 120C rating (that is, a True, Continuous 816 amp output capacity), or a sticker that says "Actual 120C!!1! OMGBBQ!!" Cuz lots of brands have 120c, 150c, 200c or whatever printed on the label. But actual load testing shows they are all a lie, as the BEST hobby grade lipos are around 55c (last time I checked, anyway)

Bedtime reading -
https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?1767093-Battery-Load-Test-Comparisons

But, overall, nice pricing breakdown on a great truck! Shows what it takes to get into the hobby with a OP setup. I have been eyeing that motor myself for my Outcast.

Yes this hobby isn't cheap if you want speed, torque and durability.

It’s stupid that when someone mentions a product they are forced to write something they don’t want to. This site should allow people to express themselves like they intended while respecting rules of decency. Ban the user not the product name.

Anyway I read your link (in the morning)… yes I agree that numbers are really unregulated on Lipo packs which is why I researched the hell out of this G.E.N.S ace before I chose it. If you do the research on this particular lipo pack and watch a ton of reviews on it, which I have, you will find it is the new hotness and the numbers are accurate. There is a reason it’s so heavy.

A little rant lol…Key board warriors (not this particular discussion as debating and testing is how we make things better) love to fire off how you could do something better or saved money this way or that but in the end it has been my experience most of the time you get what you pay for. One way or the other there is some aspect of what your buying that makes the price the price in relation to other products of the same type what it is. It could be materials, power, speed, acoustic performance, thermal dynamics etc. This isn’t fashion. It’s not just about the name. Quality is expensive. Performance is expensive. The choices I made were about how these products work as a whole. Not really talking about a Traxxas tool kit but in a way I am. The hours of research that went into picking these components was not an accident. Numbers were compared and reviews watched and real world use was considered. So I’m open to doing something better and more cost effective but when people drop comments without leaving a solution or not illustrating how a particular product isnt worth it without offering an alternative it just sounds like noise. I see this all the time in these forums.

 

[Don Pots]

I was just about to ask the same thing. The 1717 shouldn't have any issues fitting in the K6S and would have better torque.

There is a fitting issue regarding the clip. Could be bent I suppose or reversed then capped to protect wires. I would have gone for the 1717 but after factoring in weight and the pinion count I wanted this seemed like a better option on 6s not for a 8s system. I was very concerned about temps. Who knows? I’m imagining the difference in real world use is negligible. I would always opt for smaller components all things being equal.

 

[Engineer]

Well here is what they wrote on their page:

“Experience higher efficiency, advanced features and improved optimization for your stock upgrade or build with Castle’s legendary brushless power. The MAMBA MONSTER X 8S, 33.6V ESC W/1520-1650KV SENSORED COMBO is a perfect upgrade for 1/8, 1/7 and 1/6 scale vehicles weighing up to 18lbs and up to 8S LiPo. The 1520-1650Kv has all of the secret sauce that the big brother 1717-1650Kv has, but in a more compact diameter, fitting into smaller spaces without modifications to your chassis.”

“A low Kv motor has more winds of thinner wire—it will carry more volts at fewer amps, produce higher torque, and swing a bigger prop. A high Kv motor has fewer winds of thicker wire that carry more amps at fewer volts and spin a smaller prop at high revolutions.”

You can see from the link I posted that Castle responded to the AF thread by saying the 1717 has more torque than the 1520.

If you're going to call me out as an engineer, you should know that engineers believe spec sheets and test data over marketing ad copy any day of the week. But hey man, enjoy your build - as long as it brings a smile to your face, that's all that matters.

 

[Don Pots]

You can see from the link I posted that Castle responded to the AF thread by saying the 1717 has more torque than the 1520.

If you're going to call me out as an engineer, you should know that engineers believe spec sheets and test data over marketing ad copy any day of the week. But hey man, enjoy your build - as long as it brings a smile to your face, that's all that matters.

Didn't debate that fact. I was speaking about reducing overall system temp by going with a lower KV and a higher pinion.

 

[Sargent_Horse]

Didn't debate that fact. I was speaking about reducing overall system temp by going with a lower KV and a higher pinion.

Both the 1717 and 1520 cans are 1650kV. The difference is the physical can size.

Also, the difference between a lower kV motor and higher kV motor geared to produce the same final drive ratio on the same cell count is negligible at best, regarding temps.

In regards to hand tools, many of us prefer MIP over most anything else and use lower priced servos, like Amazon servos, in hard basher since in my experience hard bashing will break even expensive servos and I'd rather pay 30 bucks for a replacement. That's all up to your budget at the end of the day though.

Make sure to shim your servo saver or switch to the harder spring otherwise that strong servo will be a waste with much of the power getting lost in the servo saver.