Notorious How to know if you have enough shims?

[thepiper]

So I got my diff shims in (exterior diff shims). I have taken apart everything, removed the stock shim, which is thicker than the shims I got. How do I know how many shims to install? Even with just stock shim, I don't feel any clicking between the gears.

 

[SrC]

I use my finger with literally a wipe of grease. Just for a slippery coating.The lightest coating is all you need. Galling of the surface over time makes them corrode. These are just little tips that I picked up. Most of this I learned from building rigs in kit form from the instructions. If you build a Tekno MT for instance, you will find yourself using many building techniques with the Arrma RTR rigs. Arrma's manuals don't offer much detailed instruction by comparison. They are RTR's. Detailed Instruction manuals are costly to supply with any RTR in general. So The Arrma Forum fills in the gap for many of us IMHO. I have always been a kit builder. Arrma was my first RTR brand. Never looked seriously at any RTR rigs prior. For me, RC enjoyment was building rigs from a kit box of parts.
You get to know repairing them easily from building them first. Because your hands touched every single part during the build. Understanding the relationship of each part to another. Hard to explain any better.

 

[thepiper]

I ran the truck on the bench without wheels at a slow speed for a while (throttle trim comes in handy). I did this just to let things settle it, before putting some power down. I ran some 3 in 1 oil around the truck, wiping down some screws, the outdrives and dogbones, due to surface rust developing. I also applied the 3 in 1 to bearings and joints. Everything is smooth and squeak free again. I'll be glad when the mud guards arrive to reduce snow and junk getting caked on the rear end.

The drivetrain is really smooth now, even better than stock, and mesh seems perfect all around. Roll off throttle is definitely greater than it was before, so clearly things are turning more efficiently.

 

[SrC]

With any new rig or new diffs in general. I do figure eights , wide and tight for the first few minutes. This beds in the diff gears evenly under diff loading. Some track guy showed me this many years ago on gear diff'ed rigs. Been doing it ever since. Call me anal. Maybe its overkill. Who knows. I am a creature of habit. It cant hurt. Tight circles also helps me dial in my ST dual rate evenly for left and right. Then I just let her rip and bash.

 

[thepiper]

With any new rig or new diffs in general. I do figure eights , wide and tight for the first few minutes. This beds in the diff gears evenly under diff loading. Some track guy showed me this many years ago on gear diff'ed rigs. Been doing it ever since. Call me anal. Maybe its overkill. Who knows. I am a creature of habit. It cant hurt. Tight circles also helps me dial in my ST dual rate evenly for left and right. Then I just let her rip and bash.

I was doing some slalom (guess that's still the right term, despite the lack of cones), and general drifting around on the street. The Notorious doesn't have the best corning abilities ?

 

[SrC]

Yeah the Noto is pretty square all around. i think it turns better than my Kraton 6s though. I prefer lower profile tires on the Noto. and Kraton. Steers better. Just how I drive maybe. I tend to power slide my turns.
The stock ST servo holds you back with steering. Kind of slow and lame. I upped all my 6S rigs to 35 kg servos. To me thats a minimum. My steerng is way better. Drives like different rigs altogether.

 

[thepiper]

Yeah the Noto is pretty square all around. i think it turns better than my Kraton 6s though. I prefer lower profile tires on the Noto. and Kraton. Steers better. Just how I drive maybe. I tend to power slide my turns.

I typically slow down and go into the turn, then tap the throttle to break the rear end out. I may have to try moving the front upper mounting hole out on the front out to give better steering.

 

[SrC]

Not sure what you mean by upper mounting hole?? You mean the upper arm pillow balls at the Hubs where the shims are? That's for camber. I usually try for zero.( tires straight up when pointing straight).
The Noto. has plenty of Castor angle already when turning. Your stock servo may be the problem. If you still run stock. I had poor steering also on my Kraton, OC and Noto until I swapped out to better servos. I think they handicap driving ability. Just me. Most guys swapp them out or let the stockers crap out first. That is an important upgrade IMHO. If you still have stock. ?‍
If you want to get a bit more steering make sure your Fr tires are pointed out slightly. (Toe-Out) That always helps.

So when you turn hard, the inside tire will pull you into the turn more effectively. Also, dial in your steering Dual rate at the TX. For sharper turns. don't over do it that' s all. But the servo is always the limiting factor. Try to work around it though.

 

[thepiper]

Not sure what you mean by upper mounting hole?? You mean the upper arm pillow balls at the Hubs where the shims are? That's for camber. I usually try for zero.( tires straight up when pointing straight).
The Noto. has plenty of Castor angle already when turning. Your stock servo may be the problem. If you still run stock. I had poor steering also on my Kraton, OC and Noto until I swapped out to better servos. I think they handicap driving ability. Just me. Most guys swapp them out or let the stockers crap out first. That is an important upgrade IMHO. If you still have stock. ?‍
If you want to get a bit more steering make sure your Fr tires are pointed out slightly. (Toe-Out) That always helps.

So when you turn hard, the inside tire will pull you into the turn more effectively. Also, dial in your steering Dual rate at the TX. For sharper turns. don't over do it that' s all. But the servo is always the limiting factor. Try to work around it though.

I meant the shocks, sorry. I was thinking it was the servo, but an aluminum mount seems necessary. However, the servo saver seems weak to me, so I figured that it would only hinder a better servo. Are there any cheap, but actually good, servos? I know these Chinese companies are putting out some great things from time to time. FrSky, RadioMaster, even HBX has some stuff I'd truly call good RC trucks. There must be some decent servos.

 

[SrC]

https://www.amazon.com/ZOSKAY-Corel...8VW041598FT&psc=1&refRID=W1MN80HMM8VW041598FT
I use these now. i tried the Savox 1210. Wasn't happy with it at 3 times the price. Noisy and all, brand new.
These DS3235's are great. I tried one out, liked it and now all my 6s rigs use them. Cheap enough to replace as needed.
But whatever you get hopefully its 35 kg at minimum. The servo saver is what it is. Some change out the spring for a HD one. I don't. I don't feel a need. I get enough steering. Remember the SS spares the Servo. SS should flex a bit under stress. Servo torque has nothing to do with the SS action.
Regarding the servo mount, I don't have alloy ones in all my rigs. I do have 2 with HR ones though. I realize if i use 8 Longer screws into the plastic stock mount 4 top and 4 bottom. The longest that will fit, the mount wont flex. Also I remove the rubber servo grommets and use alu. flanged servo grommets/ washers with 4 Flat head longer screws. The mount is solid now and never moves. That may be part of your steering problem in and of itself. That's my work around. Good as my HR mount. Just need 4 servo washers.(Power Hobby or any brand) and 4 longer screws. Measure the stock mounts depth of the holes and you will see that the stock screws are very short and you can use considerably longer ones. It makes the mount way more rigid, no flexing. Just an idea as opposed to getting an alloy upgrade.

 

[thepiper]

https://www.amazon.com/ZOSKAY-Corel...8VW041598FT&psc=1&refRID=W1MN80HMM8VW041598FT
I use these now. i tried the Savox 1210. Wasn't happy with it at 3 times the price. Noisy and all, brand new.
These DS3235's are great. I tried one out, liked it and now all my 6s rigs use them. Cheap enough to replace as needed.
But whatever you get hopefully its 35 kg at minimum. The servo saver is what it is. Some change out the spring for a HD one. I don't. I don't feel a need. I get enough steering. Remember the SS spares the Servo. SS should flex a bit under stress. Servo torque has nothing to do with the SS action.
regarding the servo mount, I don't have alloy ones in all my rigs. I do have 2 with HR ones though. I realize if i use 8 Longer screws into the plastic stock mount 4 top and 4 bottom. The longest that will fit, the mount wont flex. Also I remove the rubber servo grommets and use alu. flanged servo grommets/ washers with 4 Flat head longer screws. The mount is solid now and never moves. That may be part of your steering problem in and of itself. That's my work around. Good as my HR mount. Just need 4 servo washers.(Power Hobby or any brand) and 4 longer screws. Measure the stock mounts depth of the holes and you will see that the stock screws are very short and you can use considerably longer ones. It makes the mount way more rigid, no flexing. Just an idea as opposed to getting an alloy upgrade.

Thanks! So you are just turning it into a metal mount with longer screws, much easier and cheaper

 

[SrC]

^^^ Exactly. Yeah, I must thank another AF member for this. Don't remember who it was a few years go. So I tried it on subsequent 6S rigs and it worked. I don't buy the HR mounts any more. No need. Honestly. Sure, my alloy HR mounts look trick and all. But I saved some coin for better upgrades.

Always good to buy the hardware set at JennysRC if you haven't already. You will need fasteners down the road and use them for mods like this.
The longest screws that will fit in the stock mount truly makes it strong. That's the key. Arrma did make these plastic mounts stronger as well. The original ones from real older rigs were so soft, realy bad. You absolutely needed an alloy mount back then.
BTW, I find there are many screws on these rigs that can be longer. Makes it tighter and stronger. Like the body mounts for instance. Just some ideas. As I rebuild my rigs here and there, I usually find longer screws will fit. Just measure hole depths with a hex driver for reference. You will get less stripped out parts especially in high stress areas. Arrma uses 12.9 grade fasteners. The best strength. If you source these eleswhere, keep that in mind. Only buy 12.9 grade or any stock Arrma fasteners. Don't use stainless fasteners. They are soft and also strip at the hex heads. Been there. Tried them on my Crawlers. No more.

 

[thepiper]

^^^ Exactly. Yeah, I must thank another AF member for this. Don't remember who it was a few years go. So I tried it on subsequent 6S rigs and it worked. I don't buy the HR mounts any more. No need. Honestly. Sure, my alloy HR mounts look trick and all. But I saved some coin for better upgrades.

Always good to buy the hardware set at JennysRC if you haven't already. You will need fasteners down the road and use them for mods like this.
The longest screws that will fit in the stock mount truly makes it strong. That's the key. Arrma did make these plastic mounts stronger as well. The original ones from real older rigs were so soft, realy bad. You absolutely needed an alloy mount back then.

I would if they were in Canada. The shipping will not be cheap. As I have fpv quadcopters, I usually have some extra longer bolts around, used to mount the electronics stack. I'm sure a can cut it down if need be.

Easy enough, unlike something else suggested to me. It was mentioned to put M3 lock nuts on the wing mount bolts. Tight area to work in, however, and I don't know how safe it would be to buff down part of the wing mount to fit the nut.

 

[SrC]

I never really had a problem with the wing mount screws through the shock tower.. But I see guys doing it it with Lock nuts. I guess it depends how you drive. ?‍ I break wing mounts in half and all. Never broke a wing off ironically. They are cracked in some areas and all but still in one piece. The original ones. I use RPM or stock wing mounts. I feel they are equally as strong/weak. Some differ on this. IDK which is truly better. A mixed bag.
The wing and mounts are there to protect the tower and bulkheads. They should break before anything else IMHO. ALLOY wing mounts are just bad to use. Will cause more damage and bend anyway. I think you know this anyway. BTW I don't have to tell you that cold temps make these mounts snap real easily. And other parts too. I always break more in the winter months. I try not to bash too hard in the cold.

 

[FatCatRC]

I never really had a problem with the wing mount screws through the shock tower.. But I see guys doing it it with Lock nuts. I guess it depends how you drive. ?‍ I break wing mounts in half and all. Never broke a wing off ironically. They are cracked in some areas and all but still in one piece. The original ones. I use RPM or stock wing mounts. I feel they are equally as strong/weak. Some differ on this. IDK which is truly better. A mixed bag.
The wing and mounts are there to protect the tower and bulkheads. They should break before anything else IMHO. ALLOY wing mounts are just bad to use. Will cause more damage and bend anyway. I think you know this anyway. BTW I don't have to tell you that cold temps make these mounts snap real easily. And other parts too. I always break more in the winter months. I try not to bash too hard in the cold.

What are these hd springs you speak of? And to add to the convo never buy integy or gpm servo saver servo horns. They are absolute junk, sure they look nice but are weak as hell and your turning radius is a mile.

 

[SrC]

SERVO SAVER SPRING 12x20mm X-HARD (1pc) (ARA340178) | ARRMA - Designed Fast, Designed Tough (arrma-rc.com)

Absolutely. Integy and GPM NG. I wont touch them.

 

[thepiper]

I never really had a problem with the wing mount screws through the shock tower.. But I see guys doing it it with Lock nuts. I guess it depends how you drive. ?‍ I break wing mounts in half and all. Never broke a wing off ironically. They are cracked in some areas and all but still in one piece. The original ones. I use RPM or stock wing mounts. I feel they are equally as strong/weak. Some differ on this. IDK which is truly better. A mixed bag.
The wing and mounts are there to protect the tower and bulkheads. They should break before anything else IMHO. ALLOY wing mounts are just bad to use. Will cause more damage and bend anyway. I think you know this anyway. BTW I don't have to tell you that cold temps make these mounts snap real easily. And other parts too. I always break more in the winter months. I try not to bash too hard in the cold.

Well my issue was necessarily having anything stronger, but easier to fix. If I using volts with threads only on the ends, they can be removed easier.

 

[SrC]

^^^ Your reasoning make absolute sense.

 

[FatCatRC]

SERVO SAVER SPRING 12x20mm X-HARD (1pc) (ARA340178) | ARRMA - Designed Fast, Designed Tough (arrma-rc.com)

Absolutely. Integy and GPM NG. I wont touch them.

I have a few of their parts, some are good...some not. Towers are weak and bend, arms were a big mistake, but things like top plates, body mounts and suspension mounts are okay and add bling to your build. I really like my gpm bulkheads over the HR bulkhead I have. I recomend GPM over HR for bulkheads hands down. They are cheaper and come all complete instead of having to order the sway bar mount and bulkhead cover seperate. And they come in way better colours, I mean come on if I'm spending that much atleast offer it in more colours than black and red.

 

[SrC]

I have used a considerable amount of GPM parts on my Crawlers . Very disappointed. I'm sure some of their stuff is good. But I got cold feet with them now. GPM is known to offer variety of colors which is why I bought them. If I were to get Alloy Bulkheads I would consider Vitavons. Also come as a complete set. GPM gave me bad vibes overall. I invested $hundreds$ in their stuff too. I have 3 Crawlers. I think I gave them a fair enough try. Moved on. HR can be overpriced at times I think. Sometimes feel GPM and HR use the same mfr plant. Just relabeled and finished differently.

 

[FatCatRC]

I have used a considerable amount of GPM parts on my Crawlers . Very disappointed. I'm sure some of their stuff is good. But I got cold feet with them now. GPM is known to offer variety of colors which is why I bought them. If I were to get Alloy Bulkheads I would consider Vitavons. Also come as a complete set. GPM gave me bad vibes overall. I invested $hundreds$ in their stuff too. I have 3 Crawlers. I think I gave them a fair enough try. Moved on.

So far I've had luck. Like I said there is a few things I learnt my lesson on but there is a few things I like from them. My diff internals have held up rather great considering the way I drive, but my towers folded like a banana. I really want scorched towers so I have m2c in the noto and scorched in the kraton but my wallet hurts when paypal tells me how much it will be.