Kraton 8s won’t wheelie

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Couch_Bro

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Kraton 8s BLX won’t wheelie. It has tons of power but it seems like traction may be the issue because the wheels just spin no matter what surface it’s on. Also using belted tires which don’t balloon at all and the weight doesn’t help. Specs below, any thoughts? Thanks

K8s BLX 1.5
Hobbywing MAX 5 with 800kv motor
Punch 4
34/34 gearing
500k/20M/500k diff fluid
Duratrax Six Pack X Tires
Hoovo 5500 mAh, 120C batteries
Power HD 65kg servo
Quite a few M2C and hot racing aluminum parts which add some weight. Haven’t weighed it yet but it’s a pain to carry.

68B08FAF-E4FB-4D72-BA5B-B74BE0241A1C.jpeg
 
Nice setup .
I would raise the Punch Level first (y) To accommodate that 1:1 gearing perhaps. You could probably even Overdrive the gearing with that 800kv motor some more. Looks like you need some more torque, by upping the Punch or dialing the gearing better.
Diff oils look pretty good.
Tires look like they have some good bite to them. Maybe being Belted is part of this? IDK for sure.
 
Nice setup .
I would raise the Punch Level first (y) To accommodate that 1:1 gearing perhaps. You could probably even Overdrive the gearing with that 800kv motor some more. Looks like you need some more torque, by upping the Punch or dialing the gearing better.
Diff oils look pretty good.
Tires look like they have some good bite to them. Maybe being Belted is part of this? IDK for sure.
Thanks and I was thinking about gearing up and maybe down to experiment. While the front and rear diffs do have 500k, they are both low and it looks like some leaked into the case. The center is packed though. I’m not sure if you’re familiar with the max 5 but the punch setting is only 1-5 so 4 is about 80% of the max. I started at 2 and then 3, haven’t tried 5 yet because drive shafts aren’t cheap haha.

The reason I was thinking the tires could be the issue is that by ballooning, it gets the front end moving upward which may start the wheelie. With my setup, all 4 tires, and the chassis stay level. They just spin, even on asphalt.
 
Yeah if they spin on pavement, could be a traction issue. The rig weighs about 30 pounds, no reason the rear tires cant dig in and pull up with chassis rotation. Have you tried other tires. The stockers perhaps to compare.
 
Yeah if they spin on pavement, could be a traction issue. The rig weighs about 30 pounds, no reason the rear tires cant dig in and pull up with chassis rotation. Have you tried other tires. The stockers perhaps to compare.
These are the only tires I have. I purchased it used as a slider so I’ve never tried it on different tires. It’s also been below 30° every time I’ve driven it which may be affecting the tire compound. But I’ve also been on grass and dirt so the hardness of the rubber should be as much of a factor there.

It’s not like I need to have the thing wheelie to enjoy it but I’m just stumped why it won’t…just got 2’ of snow so it doesn’t matter at the moment anyway.
 
I'm running 44/47 w/Max 5 800kv combo. Stock tires and lots of m2c upgrades. Mine will pull wheelies on demand! I'm not sure what punch level I'm set to. 🤷‍♂️
 
I had duratrax six pack tires on a Granite long ago. Ran them for a few packs, then took them off. Even on a little wheelie monster Granite, it didn't wheelie much with them. I didn't like those tires at all. Non belted tires flex and will give you traction (and balloon too though).

I suggest non belted tires, and just wrap the fronts with fishing line. Rears don't really balloon unless you are speed running.
 
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I'm running 44/47 w/Max 5 800kv combo. Stock tires and lots of m2c upgrades. Mine will pull wheelies on demand! I'm not sure what punch level I'm set to. 🤷‍♂️
I think the default is 3. If you haven’t touched it, that’s what it should be. That’s good info. Was hoping to find someone with a similar set up that can wheelie to see where the issue is before I start swapping things out blindly.

I’m really not a huge fan of these tires anyway. They almost seem too firm so I may try to pick up a set of stock tires or the ones that came stock on the EXB.
I had duratrax six pack tires on a Granite long ago. Ran them for a few packs, then took them off. Even on a little wheelie monster Granite, it didn't wheelie much with them. I didn't like those tires at all. Non belted tires flex and will give you traction (and balloon too though).

I suggest non belted tires, and just wrap the fronts with fishing line. Rears don't really balloon unless you are speed running.
Thanks for the reply. I definitely agree that these tires seem very firm. I was hoping once the weather warmed up they’d get a little more pliable but the rubber is still way thicker then stock so I don’t think they’re ever gonna flex like the stock tires. Plus they don’t help the suspension soak much up when ridding over rough terrain and landing jumps.

They do have their place though. They handle great on hard packed dirt like a track or baseball infield. I have a BMX track nearby and it absolutely rips around there...until I break something. There’s also hardly any body roll around corners so I think they’re fast, just not great for bashing.

Either way, Sounds like a new set of tires is in order. I’m already over budget by a lot so it might be a little while but I’ll update this thread once I have a chance to get some thing else.
 
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I have the kraton 8s exb with 1100 kv and xlx2.
Geared 29/39. I blew the front tire and just replaced it with a set of duratrax lockup belted in the front.
Your right it wheelies much less with belted tires. I put the belted in the front because mine wheelies a bit to much for me. Great tires so far but I will be switching the belted to the back stock to the front.
Also you said you use 5500 hoovo, I'm not sure how. I use 9500's and the longest run time I ever got was about 16min. Do you get only 10 minutes drive time? I would get bigger batteries.
 
Almost sure if you change tires you’d get some wheelies

I’d grab some backflip from Jenny’s
 
I have the kraton 8s exb with 1100 kv and xlx2.
Geared 29/39. I blew the front tire and just replaced it with a set of duratrax lockup belted in the front.
Your right it wheelies much less with belted tires. I put the belted in the front because mine wheelies a bit to much for me. Great tires so far but I will be switching the belted to the back stock to the front.
Also you said you use 5500 hoovo, I'm not sure how. I use 9500's and the longest run time I ever got was about 16min. Do you get only 10 minutes drive time? I would get bigger batteries.
Are usually get about 20-25 minutes of drive time but that’s at a BMX track where I’m hardly ever going over 50% on the throttle and just in quick bursts. I just use two sets of batteries and that’s usually enough. I may end up picking up a third set at some point though.

I did have some 8500mAh batteries and the runtime was definitely better but there was a noticeable improvement in handling when I was running the lighter batteries so I decided to just stick with those to keep the weight down. It’s a bit of a hassle to have to swap out batteries more often but it’s not a huge deal.

Times when I take it on grass and have it full throttle the majority of the time, you’re right, it’s probably under 10 minutes of run time and I could fry an egg the motor.

As for the wheelies, I played around a bunch with my gearing and I think some of it was due to being over-geared. I’m currently running 33/36 on punch 3 of 5 on the HW ESC with the 800kv motor and it will wheelie with both sets of belted tires I have. It still doesn’t want to get up but if I floor it, it will wheelie. Definitely far from doing standing backflips though. For that I think I will need belted tires.

I definitely think the tires ballooning helps to get the front end moving upward and the larger diameter also increases the force required to spin them which translates to the truck rotating backward. I’m not an engineer but that would be my guess.

How do you like the lockups? My K8 just got attacked by a pitbull the other day which tore one of the six packs I was running so I was thinking about giving them a try. the six packs were great for the money btw.
Almost sure if you change tires you’d get some wheelies

I’d grab some backflip from Jenny’s
I’ve never had non belted tires on this rig but I wasn’t really a fan on other RC’s I’ve had. I just didn’t like how unstable it felt. They were good for soaking up bumps though.

I have read nothing but good things about the backflips though. Maybe if the price is right. I’ll have to check JRC and see what they’re going for.
 
Yeah back flips are great for dirt not the best for grass though. My area is mostly short grass with some baseball diamonds.
 
Its prety awesome how we can all have the kraton 8s and they all drive differently based off of upgrades. Is the m2c chassis a lot heavier than stock?
 
Alright, I found the perfect tire set up.
I put the duratrax lockup x belted in the rear and non belted stock tirs in the front. The lighter non belted in the front drives amazing. I literally pulled a wheelie for a solid 20 feet without trying. I have never had that type of control with any tire set up on the kraton 8s.
From now on I'm belted in the rear non belted in the front. It makes sense with the lighter tires In the front. But the coolest thing was the control with the belted tires. I'm going to buy non belted duratrax SC sports for the front to match.
Absolutely AWESOME, like driving a whole new beast!!
I actually had bad luck with the six packs on my kraton 6s exb. All 4 striped one after the other.
I do have the stock kraton 8s esc in my 6s for more power but regardless I would not buy them again. They were probably to heavy for the 6s.
 
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Proline trenchers
 
I have the kraton 8s exb with 1100 kv and xlx2.
Geared 29/39. I blew the front tire and just replaced it with a set of duratrax lockup belted in the front.
Your right it wheelies much less with belted tires. I put the belted in the front because mine wheelies a bit to much for me. Great tires so far but I will be switching the belted to the back stock to the front.
Also you said you use 5500 hoovo, I'm not sure how. I use 9500's and the longest run time I ever got was about 16min. Do you get only 10 minutes drive time? I would get bigger batteries.
I had to come back to this post because I recently started bringing my rig to a more wide-open area and the batteries were draining so fast I did some calculations and figured out the actual capacity my batteries. My Hoovo 5500mAh 4S 120C lipos capacity is closer to 3000 mAh.

I guess I never noticed it because where are usually bash, there’s not a lot of opportunities to be on the throttle. I wonder if the batteries are partially to blame for my rig not being able to pop a wheelie either.

Maybe someone else can chime in but based on the chart I found online, 3.65V is around 10-20% capacity remaining. From 3.65 V to fully charged, my charger says it has added about 2500 mAh. 80% of 5500 isn’t 2500 so something is off. My charger, the lipo capacity chart, or the batteries. I have four of the same batteries and they all get about the same runtime so I think they’re just way overrated.

I do have about 40 or 50 cycles through and I feel like the capacity was better when they were new but they’ve been taken care of. I usually only run them down to 3.7 V and always use them right after charging and storage charge within a couple hours so they shouldn’t be dying already.
 
I had to come back to this post because I recently started bringing my rig to a more wide-open area and the batteries were draining so fast I did some calculations and figured out the actual capacity my batteries. My Hoovo 5500mAh 4S 120C lipos capacity is closer to 3000 mAh.

I guess I never noticed it because where are usually bash, there’s not a lot of opportunities to be on the throttle. I wonder if the batteries are partially to blame for my rig not being able to pop a wheelie either.

Maybe someone else can chime in but based on the chart I found online, 3.65V is around 10-20% capacity remaining. From 3.65 V to fully charged, my charger says it has added about 2500 mAh. 80% of 5500 isn’t 2500 so something is off. My charger, the lipo capacity chart, or the batteries. I have four of the same batteries and they all get about the same runtime so I think they’re just way overrated.

I do have about 40 or 50 cycles through and I feel like the capacity was better when they were new but they’ve been taken care of. I usually only run them down to 3.7 V and always use them right after charging and storage charge within a couple hours so they shouldn’t be dying already.
Check this YouTube video out. This guy tests a Hoovo battery and finds that half of the power available is below 3.6v. It beat its stated capacity but he had to run it down to 3.3v to use it.

 
Check this YouTube video out. This guy tests a Hoovo battery and finds that half of the power available is below 3.6v. It beat its stated capacity but he had to run it down to 3.3v to use it.

This is exactly my experience with my set of Hoovo's. I run hard on my two 3s packs in my 6s KEXB, and the big majority of the mah's are below 3.9v. Due to your change in style of driving (BMX bashing to higher off-road speed) there is more load on the battery and it's likely causing greater voltage sag which is triggering LVC early. The light duty BMX bashing let you reach lower voltages before LVC. So you may want to experiment with setting your LVC slightly lower on the esc if you can, so the batteries will finish around 3.3 or 3.2v. that should give you more mah's to use.

Something to keep in mind: given the same "C" rating, smaller 5500mah packs would be more affected by voltage sag than larger packs (like the 8500mah one). Not that the 5500's won't perform well, but just by reason of the larger 8000+ packs being easier to give out juice they will less likely to trigger LVC as early. I'd bet if you ran the equivalent 8500 pack to LVC doing the same kind of driving you're doing now the batteries would be lower than the 3.65v you're currently getting. So you'd be getting more mah's in two different ways.
 
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