Lipo battery use update. SMC gets 👎👎

JvG

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My experience is to buy lipo's direct from suppliers because you will get much better aftersales support in comparison to ebay/amazon/banggood/aliexpress.
I've been buying from Hobbyking for years now (HD's, Nanotechs and Graphenes) and had a few bad cells. In all cases they instantly sent me new ones. The good ones last 3-4 years.

I'm trying the Ovonics now in the Xmaxx. They also have warehouses all around the world and direct aftersales support.
 

Peeeenuuutt

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SMC try to jam out the biggest burst and I think to their detriment. They require gentle handling imo. I have a couple that puffed early but have lasted, I guess ...and one of em I own is scary puffed like yours.
For bashing, as mentioned...we can go cheaper with great results. Turnigy from HobbyKing is dependable and their HD line can take the abuse.
Sorry to hear you're disappointed in SMC because it appears they try hard but we're all better off safe than trying to get a sliver more punch for a few more bucks. The trucks are powerful enough even with cheaper stuff.
Maybe contact SMC to see what they can do to help?


Worth a try for that cost but C-rating is often fudged. In this case the low cost looks like a low risk worth a shot.
Turnigy heavy duty worth buying? My hobbystar packs take in 2600mah each (even though oddly enough they’re not puffed at all) so when one drops a cell I’ll probably go with those.
 

slick2500

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Turnigy heavy duty worth buying? My hobbystar packs take in 2600mah each (even though oddly enough they’re not puffed at all) so when one drops a cell I’ll probably go with those.
I have one of the 6s 5000mah bricks and so far the second one has been great, the first one looked like this when I bought it, but Hobbyking replaced it right away.
20181102_191704.jpg
 

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One thing I did notice with the SMC is the case opening for the wires doesn’t seem large enough for the wires. My negative (black) wire coming out is starting to crease/almost chaff against the case. I inspect this after every run-but it’s not looking favorable.
 

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Ron Keele

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Thoughts on HRB batteries anyone?
I have 4 "HRB 6S 22.2V 3300mAh 60C" All work great. Only have about 6 cycles on them though.

However. Dam near perfectly balanced out of the box and within 10 percent after running (always in freezing conditions) have all charged back to within 2 percent of balance charge. Time will tell, but looks good so far.
 

Danny/SMC

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When it comes to Lipo batteries there are many things that can account for them expanding and swelling. At SMC we have always focused on providing packs with higher performance as we typically want to sell packs that make a difference. That being said with the new breed of RC kits that are bigger and have more high power systems we had to reconsider our pack lineup. When selling packs with more power this means the cells have lower internal resistance. This equates to less voltage drop under load so the packs will discharge more under load as the cutoff will not kick in as early. The RTR ESCs supplied by most companies don't have an adjustable cutoff and cutoff to low. Running cells to low under load increases the chance of cell damage and cell expansion.

We released the DV series to accomodate the new breed of vehicles and the cells in these packs focus on maximum reliability at the expense of some performance but feedback has been very good on these so far. We also have very good info on our site under the Technical Info section on the top bar. For those who want to better understand Lipos this can be very helpful.

The pack shown in the first post is one of our 5000-6S Premium series which focuses on low IR to maximize voltage under load. These are small cells designed to fit a 3S in the standard 3S case and a 4S in the 3S case and 6S in 4S case. Tyipcally guys who run normal 1/10th size vehicles where a 2S pack size is required and want to go with 3S will use these smaller packs. We also sell these as a low center of gravity race pack for 1/8th scale offroad racing so you get a light and thinner 4S pack. The 6S pack can be run in a 1/8th scale buggy where a 4S pack will fit. So these are the main applications for these packs. We do offer under the DV series a 6500-6S and 8000-6S that are designed to fit in the Arrma vehicles listed in the Arrma Battery guide on the top bar of our site. These are bigger cells and under the DV series makes them more reliable. I suspect some will not want to buy these as they cost more the 5000-6S but these should be the packs used Arrma 6S kits. To compare our smaller 5000-6S pack with any other pack that is made with bigger cells is not a fair comparison. We have sold hundreds of these new 5000s and so far we have not heard any negative issues about them. That being said there is always the certain applications where a certain model of pack can have issues. For example if you run the packs down to low and use them in very demanding conditions like tall grass or sticky mud this puts allot more stress on the packs due to the amp draw being higher. In these applications a bigger pack will do better for sure.

I've been selling RC packs for over 30 years and have my own testing equipment and I can tell you that there is no company/factory that makes 100% perfect cells and there will always be the chance of cells going bad due to manfacturing defects. This is why we offer a one year warranty against manufacturing defects. If a cell shorts out which is one of the most common issues with Lipo cells we will take care of it within the first year of purchase. Many of our competitors will not warranty packs when a cell has an issue. Also when it comes to the very low priced packs you must be careful as most of them are not made using premium materials in fact RC grade cells are made with Lithium Cobalt Oxide in the cathode and many of these very low priced packs use some sort of substitute for Lithium Cobalt Oxide which decreases the cycle life. We can easily offer these packs at the same prices as others do but we believe this is not worth it. You might as well pay a bit more and get a real Lithium Cobalt Oxide pack that has a warranty.

Hope this post can help some better understand Lipo packs and if you check out our Technical Info section on the top bar of our site I think you will get even more knowledge.
 

jondilly1974

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When it comes to Lipo batteries there are many things that can account for them expanding and swelling. At SMC we have always focused on providing packs with higher performance as we typically want to sell packs that make a difference. That being said with the new breed of RC kits that are bigger and have more high power systems we had to reconsider our pack lineup. When selling packs with more power this means the cells have lower internal resistance. This equates to less voltage drop under load so the packs will discharge more under load as the cutoff will not kick in as early. The RTR ESCs supplied by most companies don't have an adjustable cutoff and cutoff to low. Running cells to low under load increases the chance of cell damage and cell expansion.

We released the DV series to accomodate the new breed of vehicles and the cells in these packs focus on maximum reliability at the expense of some performance but feedback has been very good on these so far. We also have very good info on our site under the Technical Info section on the top bar. For those who want to better understand Lipos this can be very helpful.

The pack shown in the first post is one of our 5000-6S Premium series which focuses on low IR to maximize voltage under load. These are small cells designed to fit a 3S in the standard 3S case and a 4S in the 3S case and 6S in 4S case. Tyipcally guys who run normal 1/10th size vehicles where a 2S pack size is required and want to go with 3S will use these smaller packs. We also sell these as a low center of gravity race pack for 1/8th scale offroad racing so you get a light and thinner 4S pack. The 6S pack can be run in a 1/8th scale buggy where a 4S pack will fit. So these are the main applications for these packs. We do offer under the DV series a 6500-6S and 8000-6S that are designed to fit in the Arrma vehicles listed in the Arrma Battery guide on the top bar of our site. These are bigger cells and under the DV series makes them more reliable. I suspect some will not want to buy these as they cost more the 5000-6S but these should be the packs used Arrma 6S kits. To compare our smaller 5000-6S pack with any other pack that is made with bigger cells is not a fair comparison. We have sold hundreds of these new 5000s and so far we have not heard any negative issues about them. That being said there is always the certain applications where a certain model of pack can have issues. For example if you run the packs down to low and use them in very demanding conditions like tall grass or sticky mud this puts allot more stress on the packs due to the amp draw being higher. In these applications a bigger pack will do better for sure.

I've been selling RC packs for over 30 years and have my own testing equipment and I can tell you that there is no company/factory that makes 100% perfect cells and there will always be the chance of cells going bad due to manfacturing defects. This is why we offer a one year warranty against manufacturing defects. If a cell shorts out which is one of the most common issues with Lipo cells we will take care of it within the first year of purchase. Many of our competitors will not warranty packs when a cell has an issue. Also when it comes to the very low priced packs you must be careful as most of them are not made using premium materials in fact RC grade cells are made with Lithium Cobalt Oxide in the cathode and many of these very low priced packs use some sort of substitute for Lithium Cobalt Oxide which decreases the cycle life. We can easily offer these packs at the same prices as others do but we believe this is not worth it. You might as well pay a bit more and get a real Lithium Cobalt Oxide pack that has a warranty.

Hope this post can help some better understand Lipo packs and if you check out our Technical Info section on the top bar of our site I think you will get even more knowledge.
Thank you for taking your time to help us understand. 👍🏻
 

Peeeenuuutt

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Thank you for taking your time to help us understand. 👍🏻
I agree. I commend mister @Danny/SMC for taking the time to explain to us the situation with the facts. I’m not sure about everybody else but it really means a lot to me when a person at a company takes initiative and time to read everything people have to say about their product. While many people in this thread have reported poor condition and reliability of SMC lipos, whether from misuse or manufacturing, stuff like this makes a brand worth buying from- the warranty, customer support, and vigilance of the company.
 

jondilly1974

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I agree. I commend mister @Danny/SMC for taking the time to explain to us the situation with the facts. I’m not sure about everybody else but it really means a lot to me when a person at a company takes initiative and time to read everything people have to say about their product. While many people in this thread have reported poor condition and reliability of SMC lipos, whether from misuse or manufacturing, stuff like this makes a brand worth buying from- the warranty, customer support, and vigilance of the company.
Well said. 💯
 

crimsonfancy

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Danny/SMC

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I was emailed about this particular post and thought it would be best to give my point of view. Why SMC is still in business and gets good reviews is because we have one of the best warranties in the business and we do our best to always help the customer by replying to questions about our products promptly. For example this customer who swelled up a pack if he contacts us we will offer him a discount on a replacement pack of his choice as we do offer a crash/damage discount on packs that don't fall under our warranty.

Our site is not the best looking site but we do have allot of good info on it and always try to add to the info section. If you are looking for new packs give our DV series a try and I believe you will be very happy with these packs as we spent allot of time and effort on these packs.
Friends, I may get this alarm from SMC to save packs. It solves (with a delay) why I dislike using annoying standard alarms and didn't realize there was a better product. It's on special now along with a couple packs and all the Hota chargers.

https://www.smc-racing.net/index.php?route=product/product&path=131_178&product_id=559
With so many RTR ESCs cutting off to low we decided it was time to come out with an alarm that is precise and doesn't go off due to voltage drop. I believe this is a must have item if you are using the ESCs that can't increase the cutoff. Start at 3.7v per cell and see where the cells end up. Ideally you want them to be in the low 3.7 range as soon as the alarm goes off. When the weather is cooler you may need to drop it down to 3.6v or if you use high IR cells with the substitute Lithium Cobalt Oxide material these have higher voltage drop so the cutoff needs to be decreased. By not discharging the cells down to low under load you decrease the chance of cell damage due to dendrite formation and increase the cycle life.
 

jondilly1974

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I was emailed about this particular post and thought it would be best to give my point of view. Why SMC is still in business and gets good reviews is because we have one of the best warranties in the business and we do our best to always help the customer by replying to questions about our products promptly. For example this customer who swelled up a pack if he contacts us we will offer him a discount on a replacement pack of his choice as we do offer a crash/damage discount on packs that don't fall under our warranty.

Our site is not the best looking site but we do have allot of good info on it and always try to add to the info section. If you are looking for new packs give our DV series a try and I believe you will be very happy with these packs as we spent allot of time and effort on these packs.


With so many RTR ESCs cutting off to low we decided it was time to come out with an alarm that is precise and doesn't go off due to voltage drop. I believe this is a must have item if you are using the ESCs that can't increase the cutoff. Start at 3.7v per cell and see where the cells end up. Ideally you want them to be in the low 3.7 range as soon as the alarm goes off. When the weather is cooler you may need to drop it down to 3.6v or if you use high IR cells with the substitute Lithium Cobalt Oxide material these have higher voltage drop so the cutoff needs to be decreased. By not discharging the cells down to low under load you decrease the chance of cell damage due to dendrite formation and increase the cycle life.
The irony here is we have had an abundance of users here complaining that their LVC is kicking in too soon. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤣

Again, we greatly appreciate the time you have taken to help us understand your products better.

If I may take another moment of your time, how is it that your Premium packs are so much lighter than other packs with the same rating?
 

slick2500

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When it comes to Lipo batteries there are many things that can account for them expanding and swelling. At SMC we have always focused on providing packs with higher performance as we typically want to sell packs that make a difference. That being said with the new breed of RC kits that are bigger and have more high power systems we had to reconsider our pack lineup. When selling packs with more power this means the cells have lower internal resistance. This equates to less voltage drop under load so the packs will discharge more under load as the cutoff will not kick in as early. The RTR ESCs supplied by most companies don't have an adjustable cutoff and cutoff to low. Running cells to low under load increases the chance of cell damage and cell expansion.

We released the DV series to accomodate the new breed of vehicles and the cells in these packs focus on maximum reliability at the expense of some performance but feedback has been very good on these so far. We also have very good info on our site under the Technical Info section on the top bar. For those who want to better understand Lipos this can be very helpful.

The pack shown in the first post is one of our 5000-6S Premium series which focuses on low IR to maximize voltage under load. These are small cells designed to fit a 3S in the standard 3S case and a 4S in the 3S case and 6S in 4S case. Tyipcally guys who run normal 1/10th size vehicles where a 2S pack size is required and want to go with 3S will use these smaller packs. We also sell these as a low center of gravity race pack for 1/8th scale offroad racing so you get a light and thinner 4S pack. The 6S pack can be run in a 1/8th scale buggy where a 4S pack will fit. So these are the main applications for these packs. We do offer under the DV series a 6500-6S and 8000-6S that are designed to fit in the Arrma vehicles listed in the Arrma Battery guide on the top bar of our site. These are bigger cells and under the DV series makes them more reliable. I suspect some will not want to buy these as they cost more the 5000-6S but these should be the packs used Arrma 6S kits. To compare our smaller 5000-6S pack with any other pack that is made with bigger cells is not a fair comparison. We have sold hundreds of these new 5000s and so far we have not heard any negative issues about them. That being said there is always the certain applications where a certain model of pack can have issues. For example if you run the packs down to low and use them in very demanding conditions like tall grass or sticky mud this puts allot more stress on the packs due to the amp draw being higher. In these applications a bigger pack will do better for sure.

I've been selling RC packs for over 30 years and have my own testing equipment and I can tell you that there is no company/factory that makes 100% perfect cells and there will always be the chance of cells going bad due to manfacturing defects. This is why we offer a one year warranty against manufacturing defects. If a cell shorts out which is one of the most common issues with Lipo cells we will take care of it within the first year of purchase. Many of our competitors will not warranty packs when a cell has an issue. Also when it comes to the very low priced packs you must be careful as most of them are not made using premium materials in fact RC grade cells are made with Lithium Cobalt Oxide in the cathode and many of these very low priced packs use some sort of substitute for Lithium Cobalt Oxide which decreases the cycle life. We can easily offer these packs at the same prices as others do but we believe this is not worth it. You might as well pay a bit more and get a real Lithium Cobalt Oxide pack that has a warranty.

Hope this post can help some better understand Lipo packs and if you check out our Technical Info section on the top bar of our site I think you will get even more knowledge.
I posted the TLDR version of this a page prior.

I found lipo batteries to be hit or miss no matter who you buy them from. But the random no name batteries like you get on eBay and Banggood are more miss than hit.
The irony here is we have had an abundance of users here complaining that their LVC is kicking in too soon. 🤷🏻‍♂️🤣

Again, we greatly appreciate the time you have taken to help us understand your products better.

If I may take another moment of your time, how is it that your Premium packs are so much lighter than other packs with the same rating?
I still think that issue is more battery related than esc related.
 

PowerDubs

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I still think that issue is more battery related than esc related.

Bottom line is that our toys are seriously nuts when you think about the power they contain and use.

People wonder why stuff melts, or breaks under load just don't understand the force and amps moving here.

Example- a good modern house may have 200 amp service, that is the entire amount of power in your breaker box for the whole house! Many older homes have less.

My in laws gave me a rechargable electric snow shovel for xmas- it is rated at 10 amps and 500 watts.

The motor in my Notorious is rated at 151 amps and 5000 watts.

Soooo yea....
 

jondilly1974

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Bottom line is that our toys are seriously nuts when you think about the power they contain and use.

People wonder why stuff melts, or breaks under load just don't understand the force and amps moving here.

Example- a good modern house may have 200 amp service, that is the entire amount of power in your breaker box for the whole house! Many older homes have less.

My in laws gave me a rechargable electric snow shovel for xmas- it is rated at 10 amps and 500 watts.

The motor in my Notorious is rated at 151 amps and 5000 watts.

Soooo yea....
200amps of 220VAC is waaaaaaaay more power than 200amps of 24VDC 🤷🏻‍♂️🤣🤣
 

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I've used the top expensive SMC, but I don't buy them, too expensive. The set I got with an E-Revo puffed and one had a cell failure.

After the SMC I got some cheap ass Floureon and could not tell any difference.

I've used HRB and Power Hobby, Hobbystar, Gens Ace, now Goldbat. They all perform the same. I just buy whatever is cheapest within specs I need. If they puff or go bad I don't care, just buy another cheap one. Usually the cheapest option costs about 1/3 to 1/2 of what SMC and other "premium" brands want.
 
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