Minokawa Tires

[Dingo]

However, usually a thinner tire and slim LP sidewall would not be great for jumping, but the Katar tires seem to have enough give and softness in them to help on impact.

I don't really use the Katars (er... didn't?) use them for jumping, but they were absolute MONSTERS in the grass/gravel. I was incredibly impressed with their performance considering they're a stock tire.

Did you check out GPM, as they also make aluminum diff cups & better pricing, especially if you do all 3

I just looked, and then sat there a bit sad that my HR cups came in today.

Are your Badlands premounted on 3.8's?

Negative. They were purchased pre-mounted. I wasn't quite comfortable with balancing tires just yet, since I'm only about 2 months back into RC after a 20 year hiatus. I think the next tires I'll pick up will be the terrain crushers, then possibly some unmounted Badlands that I can gorilla tape the liner to help prevent ballooning.

I went with RPM rear skid plates for both my Talion/Kraton, as they are also quite light.

My chassis has definitely seen some beating so far, so I was a bit more interested in the protection that the aluminum skid plates will provide. Those truggies sit awfully low. I've upgraded to Tekno orange springs, so it will definitely sit quite a bit higher. Perhaps a bumper solution would work properly.

 

[RCROD]

I don't really use the Katars (er... didn't?) use them for jumping, but they were absolute MONSTERS in the grass/gravel. I was incredibly impressed with their performance considering they're a stock tire.


I just looked, and then sat there a bit sad that my HR cups came in today.


Negative. They were purchased pre-mounted. I wasn't quite comfortable with balancing tires just yet, since I'm only about 2 months back into RC after a 20 year hiatus. I think the next tires I'll pick up will be the terrain crushers, then possibly some unmounted Badlands that I can gorilla tape the liner to help prevent ballooning.


My chassis has definitely seen some beating so far, so I was a bit more interested in the protection that the aluminum skid plates will provide. Those truggies sit awfully low. I've upgraded to Tekno orange springs, so it will definitely sit quite a bit higher. Perhaps a bumper solution would work properly.

Dingo. I was also out of the hobby for quite a while. No problem, as I'm not sure anyone here has tried the GPM aluminum diff cases. I've seen a few Arrma members use the HR cups though.

Are your Badlands 3.8's premounted on Desperado wheels & are they ballooning a lot? I'm wondering if mounting my "BADLANDS" on larger 4" DE Racing dish wheels I already have will make much of a difference for ballooning? On my Talion, I'm going with 60k front which should help. When I shim diffs, instead of going with 100k center, I could try 150-200k? Any comments?

I'm still debating if I will tape my Badlands, as I've heard some people had problems with the tape coming loose when under 6S power. This would cause severe unbalancing I would think & may require taking the tires off again? If I do tape, I'm thinking just one wrap with a 1/2" overlap & a small 1/2" strip on the opposite side to try and keep them in balance? I'm also going to make sure I have the Gorilla tape wrapped against the direction of the tire rotation (2 tires taped opposite from the other 2, so both sides are correct when mounting on each side (had to think about that one...) By wrapping the tape against the tire direction, hopefully will help the tape from coming loose when the tire tries to balloon? I would appreciate any comments from members who have tried Badlands on larger 4" dish wheels and if tire balloons much with or without taping, when using 6S? Also would be interested in comments from members who have glued their tires & if it's worth it?

Although I am always wary of adding more weight (especially on my Talion), I agree, it is very important to have skid plates as the bottom of the chassis takes a beating. I also wanted front protection, so went with TBR bumpers on both my Talion/Kraton (bumpers not only protect in a crash, but also have a full front skid plate to protect underside). The RPM rear skid plates are light & still offer good rear underside protection.

 

[RCROD]

Further to my last post, I'm thinking of venting my Badlands instead of taping. This will not add weight and balancing would be better w/o taping. I've heard venting tires makes a difference for keeping tire foam inside drier and therefore, helps keep tire in balance, However, does it make a difference in ballooning? I am concerned with cutting holes in my expensive Badland tires though. Running 6S, will the holes in the tire possibly start to split or tear? Can I just use a drill bit, body reamer, etc (could tear), or should I try and get a leather hole punch (for a cleaner cut hole)? Will probbaly go with 2 vent holes (1.5mm?) on opposite sides of the tire (+ make sure rim holes are sealed), or should I try taping tires instead?

 

[Dingo]

Further to my last post, I'm thinking of venting my Badlands instead of taping. This will not add weight and balancing would be better w/o taping. I've heard venting tires makes a difference for keeping tire foam inside drier and therefore, helps keep tire in balance, However, does it make a difference in ballooning? I am concerned with cutting holes in my expensive Badland tires though. Running 6S, will the holes in the tire possibly start to split or tear? Can I just use a drill bit, body reamer, etc (could tear), or should I try and get a leather hole punch (for a cleaner cut hole)? Will probbaly go with 2 vent holes (1.5mm?) on opposite sides of the tire (+ make sure rim holes are sealed), or should I try taping tires instead?

I'm incredibly curious to see what impact this has on your tires. I'm thinking of doing the same with my Duratrax XCons that just came in. I was considering using a similar tactic of a 1.5mm-2.0mm hole in the tire on the opposite areas that my inner wheel holes are.

I share some of your same concerns regarding splitting of tires, but I definitely need something to help out with my tire ballooning as well. I'm already rebuilding my diffs this weekend and going with a heavier center diff fluid to keep some of the front tire issues down, but we'll see how it works out.

My tires are already mounted, so I don't quite have the same pleasure of being able to use a belt/leather punch on them, so I'll likely either go with a body hole reamer, or with a small dremmel bit, as that might melt the plastic a little to hold the shape better. Who knows though. Time for science!

 

[chevys10zr2003]

Check out post #54 in the thread below.

https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/stock-motor-upgrade.5340/page-3

 

[RCROD]

I'm incredibly curious to see what impact this has on your tires. I'm thinking of doing the same with my Duratrax XCons that just came in. I was considering using a similar tactic of a 1.5mm-2.0mm hole in the tire on the opposite areas that my inner wheel holes are.

I share some of your same concerns regarding splitting of tires, but I definitely need something to help out with my tire ballooning as well. I'm already rebuilding my diffs this weekend and going with a heavier center diff fluid to keep some of the front tire issues down, but we'll see how it works out.

My tires are already mounted, so I don't quite have the same pleasure of being able to use a belt/leather punch on them, so I'll likely either go with a body hole reamer, or with a small dremmel bit, as that might melt the plastic a little to hold the shape better. Who knows though. Time for science!

Instead of taping, I'm now leaning towards tire venting (2 holes) and thicker diff fluid. Tire venting will definitely be lighter & also better balanced (especially if tires get wet). This I heard can even help on jumps? A good friend owns a tack store, so hopefully he will have a leather hole punch I can use for my Badlands. If venting my Badlands turn out ok, I may also try and vent my Katar tires, and possibly even my Minokawa & new Backflips tires for my Kraton. However, I will have to try a different tire hole method like you, as all 3 of these other sets of tires are premounted.

The V3 Kraton comes stock with 10k/10k/10k. I'm going with 60k/100k/7k. This should work well. The V3 Talion already comes stock with 100k in the center diff. Rick Duperbash runs 200k center & Thomas at TP-Parts RC-Xtreme runs 150k center. I'm thinking of going with 60k/150k/7k in my Talion? To get 150k weight, I guess I will have to try a 50/50 mix of both 100k & 200k? What are you thinking of trying in your Talion?

 

[Dingo]

I'm now leaning towards tire venting (2 holes) and thicker diff fluid.

That's what I ended up doing this weekend. I put two small holes with a dremmel on my XCONNS, though I didn't have much ballooning on my previous run.

The V3 Kraton comes stock with 10k/10k/10k. I'm going with 60k/100k/7k. This should work well. The V3 Talion already comes stock with 100k in the center diff. Rick Duperbash runs 200k center & Thomas at TP-Parts RC-Xtreme runs 150k center. I'm thinking of going with 60k/150k/7k in my Talion? To get 150k weight, I guess I will have to try a 50/50 mix of both 100k & 200k? What are you thinking of trying in your Talion?

I rebuilt my center diff this weekend as well, and put 200k fluid in it. Balooning on my older road tires feels less, and the car pulls a lot harder with the even power distribution to the front/rear. This weekend I will be doing the front/rear, as I'm waiting on my rebuild kits to arrive this week. I really didn't want to deal with the grease in the stock diffs, and wanted a fresh build. The bonus is that I'll have some extra stock parts in case anything goes wonky. In the end I'll be running 60k/200k/30k. We'll see how that goes, but I'm tentatively excited.

One thing to note when replacing my center diff fluid was that my motor was definitely working harder. I didn't bring a thermal gun as I didn't expect to need it for some reason. After installing a basic Castle motor fan, everything seems on the up and up, and my motor felt much cooler after a heap of straight-line runs and gravel parking lot drifting/bashing.

I'm considering an ESC/motor upgrade soon, but I'm pretty sure the BLX system will tide me over until I want to get crazy. I'll be installing my Robinson Racing 15T pinion as well, so I definitely need to keep an eye on those temps.

I'm absolutely interested in how yours ends up. If the venting goes well on the Katars, I may have to do the same on the set I picked up over the weekend. I'm a little nervous after my friend destroyed my first set.

 

[RCROD]

That's what I ended up doing this weekend. I put two small holes with a dremmel on my XCONNS, though I didn't have much ballooning on my previous run.

I rebuilt my center diff this weekend as well, and put 200k fluid in it. Balooning on my older road tires feels less, and the car pulls a lot harder with the even power distribution to the front/rear. This weekend I will be doing the front/rear, as I'm waiting on my rebuild kits to arrive this week. I really didn't want to deal with the grease in the stock diffs, and wanted a fresh build. The bonus is that I'll have some extra stock parts in case anything goes wonky. In the end I'll be running 60k/200k/30k. We'll see how that goes, but I'm tentatively excited.

One thing to note when replacing my center diff fluid was that my motor was definitely working harder. I didn't bring a thermal gun as I didn't expect to need it for some reason. After installing a basic Castle motor fan, everything seems on the up and up, and my motor felt much cooler after a heap of straight-line runs and gravel parking lot drifting/bashing.

I'm considering an ESC/motor upgrade soon, but I'm pretty sure the BLX system will tide me over until I want to get crazy. I'll be installing my Robinson Racing 15T pinion as well, so I definitely need to keep an eye on those temps.

I'm absolutely interested in how yours ends up. If the venting goes well on the Katars, I may have to do the same on the set I picked up over the weekend. I'm a little nervous after my friend destroyed my first set.

You've been busy. Very interesting read. I like hearing your good results with less ballooning & better power distribution, but I did not consider center diff heating up more with a heavier diff fluid, but does makes sense. Maybe this is why some members have upgraded their center diff to aluminum cups. Let us know if any difference when you change the front diff fluid from 10-60k? Sounds like you tried 2 different tires (X Conns & some older road tires) since you changed to 200k center? Are these both 4.0" wheels you tried? Did you not try your Badlands to see if any better? I gather no problems with shimming your center diff? What dremmel bit did you use to vent your mounted Duratrax tires? What set did you friend wreck & was it from trying to vent your tires? FYG, I'm still thinking of trying 150k in my center diff (mix 100k & 200k?)

What, upgrade the BLX already? Wait until you try the 15T pinion, as speed should be much better. I'm going with a 16T & Rick Duperbash uses a 18T pinion on his new Talion, so hopefully no temp problems for us.

I just noticed my tire glue hardened up (sealed & not opened) but should have still put in the freezer, I guess. I went to order Monday am, as I needed another shim kit, but now out of stock, so I will wait to order now. I will let you know the results when I do vent/mount my Badlands on the DE Racing 4.0" wheels. Besides the new Katar tires, I also have some other new tires I've had laying around for a few years that I can finally use now (Pro-line Calibers & Crimefighters both mounted on 4.0" Pro-line VTR wheels & both with 1/2" offset). I dyed the Caliber wheels black & they have the firm closed foam inserts (quite stiff tire but still good tread flex), so these should be good for not ballooning? My awesome looking Backflips just came in for my Kraton yesterday. Here's a pick of the Proline Calibers I can't wait to try on my Talion:

 

[Dingo]

You've been busy. Very interesting read. I like hearing your good results with less ballooning & better power distribution, but I did not consider center diff heating up more with a heavier diff fluid, but does makes sense. Maybe this is why some members have upgraded their center diff to aluminum cups.

This was exactly my worry. I've been replacing what feel like "obvious" weak points with items that will hold up a bit better. I'm also finding it fascinating to pull the car apart and really understand exactly how each item works.

After the initial reading that I had done, I felt like the obvious items would be diff cups, tightening up the diffs with shims, mounting items, and protective gear.

Let us know if any difference when you change the front diff fluid from 10-60k? Sounds like you tried 2 different tires (X Conns & some older road tires) since you changed to 200k center? Are these both 4.0" wheels you tried? Did you not try your Badlands to see if any better? I gather no problems with shimming your center diff? What dremmel bit did you use to vent your mounted Duratrax tires? What set did you friend wreck & was it from trying to vent your tires? FYG, I'm still thinking of trying 150k in my center diff (mix 100k & 200k?)

A lot of really great questions! I will definitely keep people updated on how this journey goes. If all goes well, my diff rebuild kits should be in tomorrow, and I'll begin pulling the front/rear apart this weekend. Hopefully Saturday evening or Sunday will be a few shakedown runs.

Regarding your other questions...

- I've been running the XConns, as well as some ProLine street tires. I don't recall the model offhand, but I've never been a big fan of them. They're both 4" wheels, and fairly low profile sidewalls. I've got a fresh set of Katars waiting for me, which will be vented before being run. So far with the 200k fluid, the car feels like it is pulling a lot harder. Perhaps this is the "seatpants dyno," but my friend thought it felt the same way. I'll get some images of all of the tires we're running right now, as the Talion is at my friend's house since we work on them together for the most part.

- I have not tried out the Badlands just yet. The weather here has been sub-par for driving, but I'll likely give them a try after I can get a few more shakedown runs in on the XConns. I'm really falling in love with that tire/wheel combo.

- We used a 2.5mm ball-end bit on the dremmel. I think I want to try something different next time, but I'm not sure of what I'll use just yet.

- Center diff shimming went incredibly well, outside of trying to degrease the old parts. The grease they use on the stock diffs is just plain awful. I was quite happy to use some proper oil in the diff. I ended up using the Mugen shims, one on each of the sun gears, and one on two of the four spider gears. It tightened up the diff for sure, and after it was filled, felt great.

- My buddy wrecked my original Katars about 3 days after I got my Talion. I'm still mildly miffed, but I was able to find another pair on Ebay for $45. I really enjoyed the tires, so I'm excited to have a fresh set waiting for this weekend. He destroyed a rear tire by sliding over a drain grate and catching the corner of a bolt that was holding it down. I think it was pretty much the perfect storm tearing it up.

What, upgrade the BLX already? Wait until you try the 15T pinion, as speed should be much better. I'm going with a 16T & Rick Duperbash uses a 18T pinion on his new Talion, so hopefully no temp problems for us.

Agreed! I sometimes get a little ahead of myself when looking at hop-up parts. This is one of the first times I truly have the funds to just tinker without it being a 1:1 car that I have to worry about getting to work in. Some of the parts I know will fail at one point or another. Picking up suspension mounts and all for when those break, upgrading the a-arms to allow the RPM mudflaps to protect my rear dogbones.

I've got my Castle fan in place now, I just need to get the pinion in place. The stock 14T was giving me hell trying to get it off, so I have a small RC pinion puller on the way, as I don't want to risk damaging the motor shaft. I've heard too many horror stories of people destroying a spur gear in an instance such as that.

I just noticed my tire glue hardened up (sealed & not opened) but should have still put in the freezer, I guess. I went to order Monday am, as I needed another shim kit, but now out of stock, so I will wait to order now. I will let you know the results when I do vent/mount my Badlands on the DE Racing 4.0" wheels. Besides the new Katar tires, I also have some other new tires I've had laying around for a few years that I can finally use now (Pro-line Calibers & Crimefighters both mounted on 4.0" Pro-line VTR wheels & both with 1/2" offset). I dyed the Caliber wheels black & they have the firm closed foam inserts (quite stiff tire but still good tread flex), so these should be good for not ballooning? My awesome looking Backflips just came in for my Kraton yesterday. Here's a pick of the Proline Calibers I can't wait to try on my Talion:
View attachment 15834

You mention putting tires in the freezer when gluing them? I've not had a tire pull off yet (thankfully) though my buddy has and those tires are down currently. Should we clean, prep with alcohol, then glue and put them in the freezer? I'd hate to glue them and have it break away because I did something incorrectly.


(Added some Talion images to show the XConns)

 

[RCROD]

This was exactly my worry. I've been replacing what feel like "obvious" weak points with items that will hold up a bit better. I'm also finding it fascinating to pull the car apart and really understand exactly how each item works.

After the initial reading that I had done, I felt like the obvious items would be diff cups, tightening up the diffs with shims, mounting items, and protective gear.




A lot of really great questions! I will definitely keep people updated on how this journey goes. If all goes well, my diff rebuild kits should be in tomorrow, and I'll begin pulling the front/rear apart this weekend. Hopefully Saturday evening or Sunday will be a few shakedown runs.

Regarding your other questions...

- I've been running the XConns, as well as some ProLine street tires. I don't recall the model offhand, but I've never been a big fan of them. They're both 4" wheels, and fairly low profile sidewalls. I've got a fresh set of Katars waiting for me, which will be vented before being run. So far with the 200k fluid, the car feels like it is pulling a lot harder. Perhaps this is the "seatpants dyno," but my friend thought it felt the same way. I'll get some images of all of the tires we're running right now, as the Talion is at my friend's house since we work on them together for the most part.

- I have not tried out the Badlands just yet. The weather here has been sub-par for driving, but I'll likely give them a try after I can get a few more shakedown runs in on the XConns. I'm really falling in love with that tire/wheel combo.

- We used a 2.5mm ball-end bit on the dremmel. I think I want to try something different next time, but I'm not sure of what I'll use just yet.

- Center diff shimming went incredibly well, outside of trying to degrease the old parts. The grease they use on the stock diffs is just plain awful. I was quite happy to use some proper oil in the diff. I ended up using the Mugen shims, one on each of the sun gears, and one on two of the four spider gears. It tightened up the diff for sure, and after it was filled, felt great.

- My buddy wrecked my original Katars about 3 days after I got my Talion. I'm still mildly miffed, but I was able to find another pair on Ebay for $45. I really enjoyed the tires, so I'm excited to have a fresh set waiting for this weekend. He destroyed a rear tire by sliding over a drain grate and catching the corner of a bolt that was holding it down. I think it was pretty much the perfect storm tearing it up.




Agreed! I sometimes get a little ahead of myself when looking at hop-up parts. This is one of the first times I truly have the funds to just tinker without it being a 1:1 car that I have to worry about getting to work in. Some of the parts I know will fail at one point or another. Picking up suspension mounts and all for when those break, upgrading the a-arms to allow the RPM mudflaps to protect my rear dogbones.

I've got my Castle fan in place now, I just need to get the pinion in place. The stock 14T was giving me hell trying to get it off, so I have a small RC pinion puller on the way, as I don't want to risk damaging the motor shaft. I've heard too many horror stories of people destroying a spur gear in an instance such as that.




You mention putting tires in the freezer when gluing them? I've not had a tire pull off yet (thankfully) though my buddy has and those tires are down currently. Should we clean, prep with alcohol, then glue and put them in the freezer? I'd hate to glue them and have it break away because I did something incorrectly.


(Added some Talion images to show the XConns)

Great read bud with lots of info. Those XConns on white wheels look good on your Talion. I agree, much easier, cheaper & quicker to upgrade our 1/8 scale RC's compared to upgrading a real car (daily driver is a bugeye wrx all done up & I also built a V8 S10). Maybe read up on RPM suspension arms threads, as remember something about having to modify the hingepins or something, but maybe this was just their front arms? $45 for new Katar tires/rims sounds like a good deal. Also check our jennysrc for any spare parts (suspension arms, entire driveline, complete f/r/center diffs, tires, etc), as very good prices & their customer service is top notch.

Did you remove just the center diff when you changed the fluid & shimmed? Also, are you trying to remove the pinion with the motor still in the car? I gather you pulled out the entire mid section together (motor mount, motor & center diff all in 1), as heard this makes it easier to service diff & change pinion, etc. My biggest concern ahead, is trying to remove the 3 metal to metal screws underneath, that hopefully are not overly coated with red locktite? If yes, may try the solder tip on screw method?

I hate to disappoint, but there is no secret tire gluing freezing method (this would probably even have a negative effect). My tire "GLUE" hardened up in the bottle (despite glue bottle not opened & still sealed). I tried to say I should have put the tire GLUE in the freezer, so it did not harden up. (Let this be a lesson, even if your tire glue has not been opened, put in the freezer.

Prep is very important for tire gluing. I definitely recommend cleaning the tire bead & same with the wheel where the tire gets glued to. After cleaning, some people will use alcohol (save the good stuff though), & I've even heard windex may also work. Even some scuffing of the inside wheel lip can help with the glue adhesive. Keep your hands clean & try not touching any of the areas to be glued. After gluing, let dry before flipping tire over & doing other side. I'm going to try some proper tire glue straps this time.

 

[RCROD]

That's not a tekno shock spring on the front of your V3 Talion, as thought I saw some orange on the bottom of the spring?

 

[Dingo]

That's not a tekno shock spring on the front of your V3 Talion, as thought I saw some orange on the bottom of the spring?

Those are indeed Tekno Orange springs. I ended up pulling them off and throwing them on the Kraton since I felt like they were a little too "tall."

I'm going to be working on the Talion this weekend, so I'll post some more details. We ended up only doing the center diffs last week, but the grease inside made it incredibly difficult to clean and prep the internals. Ended up buying a couple rebuild kits instead, and we'll clean the grease-covered parts in the future.

A-arms, mud guards, and diffs are on the menu this weekend. I'll be sure to provide some updates on that process, as I'll be pulling out most of the innards this weekend.

I ended up taking a 10 minute shake-down run with the Talion with my new Katars, and I think they're going to be a seldomly-used tire moving forward. They're a bit more flexible than the XConns, but in grass they're pretty awesome.

*last note* I did pull out the whole center bits when trying to change the pinion. I fully pulled out the grub screw and the pinion just wouldn't move. I didn't want to force anything, so I figured I'd get the right tool for the job.