Setting Camber and Toe

[Lingerfelter6]

There is no caster on the rear. Moving those washers front to rear or vice versa on the outer pin only change wheelbase.

Yeah, youre right. But it does affect the toe. Will check it again later, maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me

 

[2fast4u]

Yeah, youre right. But it does affect the toe. Will check it again later, maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me

They are, (your eyes). Toe is still the same. Sliding the hub forward or back does not change the angle of that pin.

 

[arelee]

You're welcome. It's an area I am experienced with. Everything applies as on a 1/1

Hey 2fast4u,
I'm new to this generation of RC cars, and bought 4 over the last couple of months. I am upgrading (2) of them for fast, straight runs on asphalt, and incorporating a "G" size rocket motor in the Typhon 6s BLX V4, (2019 model), and the Limitless. I started 2 threads about this project= "ROCKET BOOST KRATON 6S AND 8S", (about halfway doun this thread I decided that the Kratons were the wrong platform. The Typhon and the Limitless were. The other thread is, "TYPHON 6S BLX V4 MAXIMUM SPEED UPGRADE HELP". I received a lot of valuable information. However, the issues of proper adjustment of the camber and toe was never addressed. You appear to be the person to ask for assistance with angle settings and helpful tools.

Again, these will be short, fast, straight runs, (the rocket will be activated once the cars maximum speed has been met).

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

Thank's

 

[VPR01]

I went down this path last weekend, not a fan of a loose front suspension feel. My Kraton V4 came out of the box with the front wheels pointing in different directions. Not a big deal, plus it gave me something to do- conclusion I had a couple different options: Order every after market option for the front end and fart around with camber/caster/toe adjustments until my eyes are crossed or Just getting everything to pass the eye test & rip it....

 

[Headbangerfacerip]

Send it

 

[arelee]

I went down this path last weekend, not a fan of a loose front suspension feel. My Kraton V4 came out of the box with the front wheels pointing in different directions. Not a big deal, plus it gave me something to do- conclusion I had a couple different options: Order every after market option for the front end and fart around with camber/caster/toe adjustments until my eyes are crossed or Just getting everything to pass the eye test & rip it....

Hey VPR01,

Nice body on the car in your "avatar" , listing photo!

When you say "loose front suspension", if you mean the 'soft' springs that I mentioned, I was told that they were a good choice, because when they are adjusted WAY DOWN, they become very firm, while at the same time lowering the ride height . This is only one part of the equation, and only one altrernative to try on my Typhon 6s BLX V4.

Have fun with your Kraton(s).

 

[DoNoHarm]

Wanna go straight? Make sure the front wheels on your car have about 1 degree of toe IN. It really makes cars (especially 8th scale MTs) track super straight and go where you’re pointing. Want to have snappy steering? Make sure your front wheels have 1-3 degrees of toe OUT. Camber is all down to personal opinion. I tend to just make it 1 degree all around because my trucks lose their alignment after a hard bash ? rear I do a 3 degree toe in. Puts the power down well and stuff. Your diff fluid will also help you figure out what types of toe in and out you want. Ex. If you run a thicker front diff fluid than the rear, having toe-out in the front will make the car handle way too crazily.

 

[arelee]

Hey Peeeenuuutt,

Thank's for the information.

Straight speed runs on asphalt is all the Typhon 6s V4 and Limitless will be used for at this time,(with a rocket that will kick-in when the car's maximum speed has been met). So (1) degree toe IN for the front, and (1-3) OUT for the rear. Is that correct?

It has been suggested that I use 1,000,000CST fluid in both front and rear differentials, (I am going to "spool" the center). Will the above "toe" angles still apply, with the fluid I am using?

How do I measure the "toe" degrees, and what measurement tools do I need?

Thank you for your time and advice.

 

[bicketybam]

Hey Peeeenuuutt,

Thank's for the information.

Straight speed runs on asphalt is all the Typhon 6s V4 and Limitless will be used for at this time,(with a rocket that will kick-in when the car's maximum speed has been met). So (1) degree toe IN for the front, and (1-3) OUT for the rear. Is that correct?

It has been suggested that I use 1,000,000CST fluid in both front and rear differentials, (I am going to "spool" the center). Will the above "toe" angles still apply, with the fluid I am using?

How do I measure the "toe" degrees, and what measurement tools do I need?

Thank you for your time and advice.

Toe is fixed on the rear unless you swap in aftermarket parts. Most people just eyeball toe because in reality there is enough slop in the steering that it won't consistently stay set anyway. 1 mil front and rear with a spooled center is fine as long as you don't plan on turning.

 

[DoNoHarm]

Toe is fixed on the rear unless you swap in aftermarket parts. Most people just eyeball toe because in reality there is enough slop in the steering that it won't consistently stay set anyway. 1 mil front and rear with a spooled center is fine as long as you don't plan on turning.

^^ this. I just barely, barely point the front wheels inward when I want toe in... almost unnoticeable to the naked eye.

Hey Peeeenuuutt,

Thank's for the information.

Straight speed runs on asphalt is all the Typhon 6s V4 and Limitless will be used for at this time,(with a rocket that will kick-in when the car's maximum speed has been met). So (1) degree toe IN for the front, and (1-3) OUT for the rear. Is that correct?

It has been suggested that I use 1,000,000CST fluid in both front and rear differentials, (I am going to "spool" the center). Will the above "toe" angles still apply, with the fluid I am using?

How do I measure the "toe" degrees, and what measurement tools do I need?

Thank you for your time and advice.

As for the front though (which is adjustable), yes all of that still applies

 

[Full Throttle R/C]

Hey Peeeenuuutt,

Thank's for the information.

Straight speed runs on asphalt is all the Typhon 6s V4 and Limitless will be used for at this time,(with a rocket that will kick-in when the car's maximum speed has been met). So (1) degree toe IN for the front, and (1-3) OUT for the rear. Is that correct?

It has been suggested that I use 1,000,000CST fluid in both front and rear differentials, (I am going to "spool" the center). Will the above "toe" angles still apply, with the fluid I am using?

How do I measure the "toe" degrees, and what measurement tools do I need?

Thank you for your time and advice.

Just to clarify, castor is a measurement between the upper and lower ball joints on a vehicle. Positive castor would be moving the upper ball joint back (towards the rear of the vehicle. The higher the castor the more stability at higher speeds. Castor set anymore than a1/2 degree will cause a pull and the pull will be to the lesser side. Our vehicles run no more than a 1/2 degree positive on the right side to compensate for the crown in the road. For high speed runs on R/C I'd run neg toe no more than 1 degree front and rear because when the vehicle is going forward it will go to close to zero toe and have less resistance. As for camber I'd run zero degrees front and rear. I reccomend this as a starting point and then you can adjust and fine tune to your liking and highest speed. ? I've been an automotive technician for over 30 years.

 

[arelee]

Toe is fixed on the rear unless you swap in aftermarket parts. Most people just eyeball toe because in reality there is enough slop in the steering that it won't consistently stay set anyway. 1 mil front and rear with a spooled center is fine as long as you don't plan on turning.

Thank's man,
One last question. When you say, "1 mil front and rear with a spool is fine as long as you don't plan on turning", what exactly do you mean by "don't plan on turning"? These will be straight runs, but I do need to turn the cars around, to bring them back to me.

Thank's again.

Just to clarify, castor is a measurement between the upper and lower ball joints on a vehicle. Positive castor would be moving the upper ball joint back (towards the rear of the vehicle. The higher the castor the more stability at higher speeds. Castor set anymore than a1/2 degree will cause a pull and the pull will be to the lesser side. Our vehicles run no more than a 1/2 degree positive on the right side to compensate for the crown in the road. For high speed runs on R/C I'd run neg toe no more than 1 degree front and rear because when the vehicle is going forward it will go to close to zero toe and have less resistance. As for camber I'd run zero degrees front and rear. I reccomend this as a starting point and then you can adjust and fine tune to your liking and highest speed. ? I've been an automotive technician for over 30 years.

Thank's ,

Very helpful. I'll write it down.

 

[bicketybam]

Thank's man,
One last question. When you say, "1 mil front and rear with a spool is fine as long as you don't plan on turning", what exactly do you mean by "don't plan on turning"? These will be straight runs, but I do need to turn the cars around, to bring them back to me.

Thank's again.

Thank's ,

Very helpful. I'll write it down.

You'll be able to the turn the car around, lol. It just won't turn well.

 

[arelee]

That's good to know. You had me spooked there.

Why would the diff. fluid have anything to do with how a car turns?

 

[Full Throttle R/C]

That's good to know. You had me spooked there.

Why would the diff. fluid have anything to do with how a car turns?

The thickness of the fluid makes a big difference depending on what you want the car to do

 

[jondilly1974]

That's good to know. You had me spooked there.

Why would the diff. fluid have anything to do with how a car turns?

Because the thinner the fluid, the more independent each wheel is side to side. The thicker it is, the more locked they are.

Knowing that, imagine your rear tires spinning. If the outside tire spins faster, it will steer your car in the opposite direction. So thinner fluid allows the outside wheel to spin faster, in essence giving you rear steering.

This effect is less effective up front, which is why most run thicker fluid up front than the rear.

 

[Rons RC]

@2fast4u - I’m having a female dog of a time with the front camber. I think the wheel extenders have something to do with it. First, the wheel extenders had a lot of play in them. There was so much play that it could change the camber by as much as 5 degrees. I finally added a shim and that firmed them up
View attachment 22074

Now when I set -2 camber on the front tires, the pivot balls look like this:

View attachment 22075View attachment 22076

Before I go and try to find some washers to use as spacers, does this seem normal to you? I took off the wheel extenders and put the stock tires on and the camber changed significantly. I could run -2 on the stock tires and not have to adjust the top pivot balls nearly as much. Thoughts?

The shim idea, just solved an issue that I've been having. I keep bending the wheel axle between the shaft pin and bearing. I never paid attention to the slop before, but I'm sure that's the issue.

Thanks for posting.

 

[arelee]

Because the thinner the fluid, the more independent each wheel is side to side. The thicker it is, the more locked they are.

Knowing that, imagine your rear tires spinning. If the outside tire spins faster, it will steer your car in the opposite direction. So thinner fluid allows the outside wheel to spin faster, in essence giving you rear steering.

This effect is less effective up front, which is why most run thicker fluid up front than the rear.

Thank's jondilly1974 . Makes perfect. I get it now.

 

[VPR01]

I went back thru my adjustments today with the Heaviest 6S battery I run, and used this as a baseline for my janky alignment. I was surprised how much the numbers changed with different packs. But, Geometry was never really my fav subject. Judging by my tire wear today beating the KRATON in a semi abusive manner all afternoon-it appears to be dialed in.

 

[arelee]

Yeah, math was never my high point either.

I'm still loving the paint job on the body of your avatar listing photo. Clear down the middle. I may use the same idea on a GT body I am going to order.