The reasons behind not selling "kits"

[kit_guy]

Hi all,

New to the forums - so hello!

I am one of I suspect a number of people out there who love building up their models as kits.

The market seems to be filled with RTR products in the main. The thing is, I'm probably being stupid but don't understand why people don't sell products in kit form?

- On the face of it, it will be cheaper to make as no factory assembly required. I recognise that depending on the motor/electronics etc the final cost could go either way.
- It opens up the market to an older and more affluent market (80s/90s folk who love their builds like me)
- It also opens up the market more to "enthusiasts" who can really modify/bespoke their builds as they see fit and help sell the models to the general public.
- It shouldn't really impact the RTR market in a significant way as the people who want to pay->play can still do so.
- Finally, and I really don't know this, it offers Arrma the opportunity to sell more upgrade parts, as people building from ground up I think are more likely to spend the money on these up front, rather than tear down and rebuild to install.

That last comment is a bit flakier than the others, but a personal observation as now with the kids/dog/wife time is much more limited, so it becomes a pain in the backside to have to break everything down just to get that one part installed.

Anyhow, would love to hear what others think. Personally, would love to buy but can't do RTR as the build is a huge part of the value to me.

Raj

 

[Clubin]

I want a arrma 6s kit. They don’t seem interested to do it.

 

[Jimbobjr]

Just get parts and make your own. Many of us have...

 

[kit_guy]

Jimbobjr/Clubin - thanks for the replies.

Jim, I understand where you are coming from. However, to spend time to sit down, and then look through the parts list and then manually order each one is a real faffing around exercise. If they had "complete set of parts minus ESC/MOTOR/RX/TX" option, that would help.

I also don't believe there is a build manual?

To be clear, Arrma are running their business as they see best. These guys are smart and there are probably some great reasons to not offer kits. I am just trying to understand what some of those may be from other forum members who may have a different angle.

 

[Yas]

The real engineers strip their cars down after a few runs or even before they run them ? there are still self assembly kits, just not as many for the basher market. I agree with the satisfaction of doing a build from scratch though

Manufacturers might have figured that kits could get left unbuilt so no extra parts are bought, or else they could get built incorrectly and the brand gets blamed

 

[Branson_Basher]

I like painting the body myself so I'll always go with a kit over RTR. It just seems silly to pay for a prepainted body I won't use.

 

[Jerry-rigged]

I was in the hobby back in the 90's, when RTR became a thing. When Traxxas released their first RTR, it was cheaper than most similar kits, and everyone assumed it was just cheap quality. Well, maybe it was, but other MFGRs jumped on the RTR train, and most all were able to offer RTR for same/cheaper than buying kit+electronics. This really confused my at the time...

BUT - Jason Dearding's latest Q&A, he talked about how it is actually easier/cheaper from the factory POV to build and QC RTR's vs packaging & QC'ing kits, writing manuals, and all that. Kind of makes sense.. If the cost is similar, but you will sell more assimbled RTR vs kits, then RTR them bad boys!

Last, Yeah I like kits. But, buying a kit just adds one build to the life of a car. RTR, I still end up doing a full teardown ever few dozen runs, so I still get to build it... Take my Granite 4x4. RTR, yeah, but Friday Morning it looked like this -

And Friday Afternoon it looked like this -

No need for a kit to get that build experience, just run it, break it, fix it!


With all that said, I would like a "80% build" Roller with a clear body, no electronics option.

Jerry

 

[Branson_Basher]

With all that said, I would like a "80% build" Roller with a clear body, no electronics option.

Jerry

My last purchase was an 80% kit and I think it makes the most sense all around.
The manufacturer doesn't have to change the assembly line, just pull them off before the electronics are installed and box it up with a clear body.

I think the reason a lot of RTR brands won't offer an 80% kit is the agreement they made with the electronics supplier.

 

[Jimbobjr]

Every month or so this same thread comes around again. Kits are fun, and rtr have been around before the 90’s (tamiya holiday buggy...). If you want a kit, buy a tamiya, tekno, Mugen, or what ever. If you want a Arrma kit buy an rtr, take it all apart, sell the electrics and put you own in and put it all back together to your liking.

If Arrma is smart they will never offer a kit. Everyone will just complain about price, quality, instructions or that it isn’t as good as tekno.

 

[fpvmiller]

All solid povs here I think on why the rtr market exists. Enticing new comers with the price while still offering a foundation for modders to improve on.

I started out with kits as well. Reading the instructions and putting every single screw in the right place. I mean literally. I used to assemble losi stadium trucks for friends because they didn't have the drive and motivation for it. Even then they almost gave up when it came to figuring out the radio system. This was back when crystals were common (am/fm).

So kits are nice and still exist in some form (racing rigs) but for the average consumer rtrs hit the spot.

For the modders/tinkerers it just gives a chance to make an rtr our own

 

[Branson_Basher]

Every month or so this same thread comes around again. Kits are fun, and rtr have been around before the 90’s (tamiya holiday buggy...). If you want a kit, buy a tamiya, tekno, Mugen, or what ever. If you want a Arrma kit buy an rtr, take it all apart, sell the electrics and put you own in and put it all back together to your liking.

If Arrma is smart they will never offer a kit. Everyone will just complain about price, quality, instructions or that it isn’t as good as tekno.

Lol Nobody compares Arrma to Tekno

 

[Jimbobjr]

Lol Nobody compares Arrma to Tekno

Lol, how long have you been a member here? Countless threads.

 

[Branson_Basher]

Lol, how long have you been a member here? Countless threads.

Favorably. I should have said no one compares Arrma favorably to Tekno.

My mistake. I can see how my post could have confused some people.

 

[kit_guy]

BUT - Jason Dearding's latest Q&A, he talked about how it is actually easier/cheaper from the factory POV to build and QC RTR's vs packaging & QC'ing kits, writing manuals, and all that. Kind of makes sense.. If the cost is similar, but you will sell more assimbled RTR vs kits, then RTR them bad boys!

Thanks Jerry, I just watched it and didn't realise how different or difficult it was to put something in kit form. Maybe it will have to be a purchase, followed by complete strip down and rebuild - at least I won't be wondering why! =)

 

[Jimbobjr]

Favorably. I should have said no one compares Arrma favorably to Tekno.

My mistake. I can see how my post could have confused some people.

My point exactly, why the heck would Arrma ever offer a kit. It would be like tekno offering a rtr. I have both btw...

 

[drjim]

My only "gripe" about Arrma is the poor quality documentation that's available for those of us who really like to tinker. I suspect ALL RTR manufacturer's are the same way, but as I only have Arrma RTR's I have no experience with other current products.

My 3Racing on-road car was a kit, and has a pretty decent manual, which also includes some blank suspension set-up sheets to keep track of your changes.

Manuals are very expensive to produce. One of my job responsibilities when I did the big motor control stuff (think 75HP and up ESC's) was the manuals. We had a first-class draftsman, but he could only draw what you explained to him. All the hundreds of words in the manual explaining what the thing was, how it worked, how to install and maintain it, and the parts list, were mine.

Drove me nutty at times...

 

[JvG]

Almost everything we buy is RTR:

A real car, a tv, a phone, a washing machine, a pc, a radio.
Only a handful of people builds there own, it's small market. You first really have to know what you are doing and what components you need.

I started with a Tamiya kit and after that it took me 4 years before i quitted buying RTR rc's and started buying rollers and put together all the components of my liking.

 

[bicketybam]

My only "gripe" about Arrma is the poor quality documentation that's available for those of us who really like to tinker. I suspect ALL RTR manufacturer's are the same way, but as I only have Arrma RTR's I have no experience with other current products.

My 3Racing on-road car was a kit, and has a pretty decent manual, which also includes some blank suspension set-up sheets to keep track of your changes.

Manuals are very expensive to produce. One of my job responsibilities when I did the big motor control stuff (think 75HP and up ESC's) was the manuals. We had a first-class draftsman, but he could only draw what you explained to him. All the hundreds of words in the manual explaining what the thing was, how it worked, how to install and maintain it, and the parts list, were mine.

Drove me nutty at times...

The last two trucks I purchased, the Losi Tenacity DB Pro and the Team Redcat Kaiju came with awful manuals. Not even a freaking schematic. I think Arrma does a great job with their manuals.

 

[Branson_Basher]

My point exactly, why the heck would Arrma ever offer a kit. It would be like tekno offering a rtr. I have both btw...

Kits don't have to be top tier race rigs; consider the $300 Proline Pro Fusion SCT or even the Red Cat Gen8 kit.

There is a pretty good market for the kit version of popular RTR vehicles and it's my opinion Arrma would sell plenty.

The greatest argument for an Arrma kit is to consider how soon you'll have to tear apart a RTR to replace EVERY SINGLE bearing! While you're at it go ahead and upgrade the servo. You know everyone does.

How're the bearings in that RTR motor doing? Gotta check em out and maybe replace them too...
Awe heck, let's just upgrade it to something better. Or just run it until you can warranty it to Horizon for a replacement because that's fun.

Sound familiar?

 

[drjim]

The last two trucks I purchased, the Losi Tenacity DB Pro and the Team Redcat Kaiju came with awful manuals. Not even a freaking schematic. I think Arrma does a great job with their manuals.

Having cars from only two different manufacturer's, I have a very limited sample.

I'd give the 3Racing manuals a "B+", and the Arrma ones a "C-". My old Kyosho manuals would have been a "B+", but a Heathkit manual would be an "A+", summa cum laude.....