Kraton Why do people choose the kraton over a talion?

[Jluther@becoinc]

@SrC
my kraton doesn't like jumps are you sure theyre made to do them?

Your Kraton is defective. Put back in box and mail it to me!

 

[SrC]

@SrC
my kraton doesn't like jumps are you sure theyre made to do them?

Need some time to re evaluate this.......................

 

[CameronCodes]

Need some time to re evaluate this.......................

are you saying it me?

 

[GRC]

The difference is what they're designed for. Talion is designed for better speed/handling on the ground. With larger tires, longer shocks, and more ground clearance, the Kraton will clear rougher terrain and have more air control. Bars & Tone recently got a Talion. The air control was lacking until he put bigger tires on.

 

[Primarrma]

My take on this is that a lot of people who comment on this topic haven't actually owned a Talion(and a Kraton together), it's easy to look at the Talion and say it has short shocks and it isn't designed for jumping, but the type of jumping I was doing with these two trucks it didn't matter. The shocks only slowed the chassis down slightly before it hit the ground anyway. In a lot of situations it was the rebound that mattered the most. I was able to get longer bigger jumps with the Talion due to it being faster and more stable.

Tyres are a non permanent feature of a car, most people who have built a kit understand that you don't even get tyres with most RCs. The Katars are a good tyre for speed and have proven to be very robust on big jumps for me. I agree that you won't have the air control you get from a heavier tyre and that is easy to change as noted above. Though it is also fun to learn to drive a truck with light tyres, and just like the Typhon it has very small light tyres, but you can still backflip and front flip these trucks with some practice.

The lp backflips are a near perfect tyre for a lot of us as these have enough weight for jumping and controlling the truck, without the mass of the huge 6s tyres that can become a handful with a lot of wheel speed.

Anyone trying to decide between these two trucks is lucky, because if you choose either one you'll be able to have a load of fun. My only advice here would be, try to keep the Talion light, it is a joy to drive with minimal upgrades, once you weigh it down it doesn't cope well, the Kraton design can handle a fair bit more in terms of upgrades, but it is a fast agile truck in minimalist form. I still have one I built as a race platform, which worked quite well.

 

[parcou]

Anyone trying to decide between these two trucks is lucky, because if you choose either one you'll be able to have a load of fun. My only advice here would be, try to keep the Talion light, it is a joy to drive with minimal upgrades, once you weigh it down it doesn't cope well, the Kraton design can handle a fair bit more in terms of upgrades, but it is a fast agile truck in minimalist form. I still have one I built as a race platform, which worked quite well.

View attachment 176080View attachment 176081View attachment 176082

Thx

This is a good post as well as all the others who shared. I posted asking the same and ended up with a Kraton 6S EXB. The look between the two was a concern not knowing later other body options. I will never jump it to the potential it is designed for not my taste. I am an on the ground person but I do want performance well on the surface more. I may struggle in that area as I do see on the videos with the Tailon just whips and turns like a dream, but I did want room for durability and upgrades when I crash badly. Sure with shock and other adjustments I can get it there....maybe we will see

I bought some Powerhobby Scorpion belted tires my hope with that I get a little more tire slip so I can drive and dirt drift and take some punch out to keep it down more. Heck, it's still in the box waiting for me to put it together and test it. It looks like I like a Tailon style drive on the ground but ended up with a Kraton for future skill growth but trying to tame the beast to be fun on the ground mainly RC.

As you vets tell me....the fun is in the testing and tuning I think I can get the Kraton where I want it as I learn and read more. Wish me luck and thx for all this positive thread feedback!!

 

[SrC]

My take on this is that a lot of people who comment on this topic haven't actually owned a Talion(and a Kraton together), it's easy to look at the Talion and say it has short shocks and it isn't designed for jumping, but the type of jumping I was doing with these two trucks it didn't matter. The shocks only slowed the chassis down slightly before it hit the ground anyway. In a lot of situations it was the rebound that mattered the most. I was able to get longer bigger jumps with the Talion due to it being faster and more stable.

Tyres are a non permanent feature of a car, most people who have built a kit understand that you don't even get tyres with most RCs. The Katars are a good tyre for speed and have proven to be very robust on big jumps for me. I agree that you won't have the air control you get from a heavier tyre and that is easy to change as noted above. Though it is also fun to learn to drive a truck with light tyres, and just like the Typhon it has very small light tyres, but you can still backflip and front flip these trucks with some practice.

The lp backflips are a near perfect tyre for a lot of us as these have enough weight for jumping and controlling the truck, without the mass of the huge 6s tyres that can become a handful with a lot of wheel speed.

Anyone trying to decide between these two trucks is lucky, because if you choose either one you'll be able to have a load of fun. My only advice here would be, try to keep the Talion light, it is a joy to drive with minimal upgrades, once you weigh it down it doesn't cope well, the Kraton design can handle a fair bit more in terms of upgrades, but it is a fast agile truck in minimalist form. I still have one I built as a race platform, which worked quite well.

View attachment 176080View attachment 176081View attachment 176082

You Truggy is sweet. Body and all.

 

[SrC]

The difference is what they're designed for. Talion is designed for better speed/handling on the ground. With larger tires, longer shocks, and more ground clearance, the Kraton will clear rougher terrain and have more air control. Bars & Tone recently got a Talion. The air control was lacking until he put bigger tires on.

^^^
They are just 2 different rigs. So they drive different. Why split hairs on this. One better than the other??? We can do this all day long. Agreeing or disagreeing. Who cares. It's all subjective interpretation. Whether you own both or one or the other. Put whatever tires you want. Change them up. We all drive differently and expect different qualities in regards.
Get whatever floats your boat. All that matters. Get both even. Get them all.

 

[marucci87]

I love my Talion exb, always wanted a Talion and when I was ready to buy one I couldn’t find any, only used and I do not buy used Rc cars, you have no idea what your getting. But that’s just me, anyway when the EXB promos came out I couldn’t wait to get my hands on one, it was a ruff start due to QC issues and I’m waiting on my second esc to arrive under warranty but it is my most used Rc…I have a xmaxx, outcast 8s, Tekno Mt410, Tekno Et48 2.0, TLR 8ight elite, point is all kinds of great handing cars but I gravitate to the Talion all the time, it takes a beating. I have I guess 50 plus hard runs on it and haven’t broke anything on it and I mean nothing besides 2 ESCs. When I can’t get esc and motor related warranty’s I’ll drop in a Hobbywing xr8 plus with the 4274..or a max8 combo. I never understood the Kraton, my opinion you mine as well get a monster truck, I can’t call it a truggy at all but the Talion is a truggy and handles pretty damn well for how heavy the exb version is. It’s not the Tekno Et48 2.0 but nothing really is, I would say handling wise they are on the same planet but miles away, the stock Et48 2.0 will not take the beating the Talion does.

 

[Primarrma]

I love my Talion exb, always wanted a Talion and when I was ready to buy one I couldn’t find any, only used and I do not buy used Rc cars, you have no idea what your getting. But that’s just me, anyway when the EXB promos came out I couldn’t wait to get my hands on one, it was a ruff start due to QC issues and I’m waiting on my second esc to arrive under warranty but it is my most used Rc…I have a xmaxx, outcast 8s, Tekno Mt410, Tekno Et48 2.0, TLR 8ight elite, point is all kinds of great handing cars but I gravitate to the Talion all the time, it takes a beating. I have I guess 50 plus hard runs on it and haven’t broke anything on it and I mean nothing besides 2 ESCs. When I can’t get esc and motor related warranty’s I’ll drop in a Hobbywing xr8 plus with the 4274..or a max8 combo. I never understood the Kraton, my opinion you mine as well get a monster truck, I can’t call it a truggy at all but the Talion is a truggy and handles pretty damn well for how heavy the exb version is. It’s not the Tekno Et48 2.0 but nothing really is, I would say handling wise they are on the same planet but miles away, the stock Et48 2.0 will not take the beating the Talion does.

I agree with you mate. How good is it to drive the Tekno ET48 2.0? My basher ET has very minimal upgrades, just a couple of braces and some bumpers, it is tougher than any of my Arrma rigs, I haven't owned an exb so I don't know what they are like, but the Talion was my favourite RC until I got my first ET48 2.0.

You Truggy is sweet. Body and all.

Thank you, it was a great project, fun giving the guys with nice kit built trucks a run for their money, haha.

 

[KnowAir]

Am I missing something?

For me, it's a price thing unfortunately. I really would prefer to have the talion, but it's only available as an rtr so..
If Arrma would put out an EXB roller, I'd be owning one already c'mon ARRMA..

 

[marucci87]

I agree with you mate. How good is it to drive the Tekno ET48 2.0? My basher ET has very minimal upgrades, just a couple of braces and some bumpers, it is tougher than any of my Arrma rigs, I haven't owned an exb so I don't know what they are like, but the Talion was my favourite RC until I got my first ET48 2.0.

Thank you, it was a great project, fun giving the guys with nice kit built trucks a run for their money, haha.

My Tekno ET48 is my favorite Rc I own second would be the Tekno MT410, I too only have the rear brace and front from m2c….tbh I really don’t jump more then 12ft with it, it it’s my baby…I’m just guessing it won’t be great for a lot of hard landings…but it is alot lighter then my Talion who know but I’m not going to start sending it to the moon.

 

[Primarrma]

My Tekno ET48 is my favorite Rc I own second would be the Tekno MT410, I too only have the rear brace and front from m2c….tbh I really don’t jump more then 12ft with it, it it’s my baby…I’m just guessing it won’t be great for a lot of hard landings…but it is alot lighter then my Talion who know but I’m not going to start sending it to the moon.

I've been jumping 100ft with these trucks and I've hard very few issues, the worst incident was landing hard on one of the front wheels in a nose dive and braking a front shock cap on my ET48 2.0. My MT410 is stock and it is going great so far.

The Talion I built up with all the M2C parts was great, but it's too heavy and slow to change direction. It was nicer to drive stock, but I kept breaking it every session.

 

[marucci87]

I've been jumping 100ft with these trucks and I've hard very few issues, the worst incident was landing hard on one of the front wheels in a nose dive and braking a front shock cap on my ET48 2.0. My MT410 is stock and it is going great so far.

The Talion I built up with all the M2C parts was great, but it's too heavy and slow to change direction. It was nicer to drive stock, but I kept breaking it every session.

I beat my stock mt410 hard, I finally had my first issue the rear gear case outter pinion bearing failed after months of beating…

 

[SrC]

I have as much wear on my MT410 as my Noto. Never broke any diff. Not once. Bent a rear tower once, because there is no wing or wing mount. Easily put on if I cared to. My MT is as fast on 4s as my Noto on 6s . Same dimensions. MT410 is much lighter and all 7075 alloy. Feels more balanced. Shocks are among the best. 2 different worlds. You pay for this.
I prefer C hub front ends much more than PB 's on the Arrma's. Better Castor and camber control than the Arrma's.
Tekno Taiwan plastics are superior. Fit and finish.

 

[marucci87]

I have as much wear on my MT410 as my Noto. Never broke any diff. Not once. Bent a rear tower once, because there is no wing or wing mount. Easily put on if I cared to. My MT is as fast on 4s as my Noto on 6s . Same dimensions. MT410 is much lighter and all 7075 alloy. Feels more balanced. Shocks are among the best. 2 different worlds. You pay for this.
I prefer C hub front ends much more than PB 's on the Arrma's. Better Castor and camber control than the Arrma's.
Tekno Taiwan plastics are superior. Fit and finish.

I run my on 6s every time I use it, it’s a monster. It does rolling back flips on the ground. I put Delran

I have as much wear on my MT410 as my Noto. Never broke any diff. Not once. Bent a rear tower once, because there is no wing or wing mount. Easily put on if I cared to. My MT is as fast on 4s as my Noto on 6s . Same dimensions. MT410 is much lighter and all 7075 alloy. Feels more balanced. Shocks are among the best. 2 different worlds. You pay for this.
I prefer C hub front ends much more than PB 's on the Arrma's. Better Castor and camber control than the Arrma's.
Tekno Taiwan plastics are superior. Fit and finish.

I run my on 6s every time I use it, it’s a monster. It does rolling back flips on the ground. I put delrin shock pistons in it and that made the shock even better, metal spur and metal servo horn and that’s all, stock fluid weights, it triple back flips off small jumps, front flips at ease, and handles like a king on the ground for a short wheel base…I had all Traxxas 1/10 scale cars and the Xmaxx before that so the handling was on another par, I never bought another Traxxas after that…I didn’t realize what was out there in the RC market until then, when I was a kid I had all Traxxas gas cars, then when I got back into it a year ago I naturally bought Traxxas. Now I see how horrible they handle and over priced they are…the xmaxx is good and the maxx but their stuff is really over priced, I will never buy Traxxas again, I also said I wouldn’t buy rtrs after my Teknos and TLR, but Arrma really surprised me. After I got this Infraction today it really makes me want to build a high end drift car kit, but we’ll see. There’s nothing like building a kit from the ground up customizing everything you want. I have 3 Teknos, Et48 2.0, Mt410, Et410.2 and they all handle great, I really enjoy they 1/10 truggy on a proper track. When they release the NT48 2.0 I will get back into nitro.

 

[KnowAir]

I have as much wear on my MT410 as my Noto. Never broke any diff. Not once. Bent a rear tower once, because there is no wing or wing mount. Easily put on if I cared to. My MT is as fast on 4s as my Noto on 6s . Same dimensions. MT410 is much lighter and all 7075 alloy. Feels more balanced. Shocks are among the best. 2 different worlds. You pay for this.
I prefer C hub front ends much more than PB 's on the Arrma's. Better Castor and camber control than the Arrma's.
Tekno Taiwan plastics are superior. Fit and finish.

Totally agreed.. my only damages on the mt410 are body mounts(a given) and bent front cv shafts.. it is just so smooth,light and hellafast on 4s...built one out for about $650(thanks to JRC).. off topic, I'm sorry.
Shame the Talion isn't offered without electronics. Maybe it's just me, but I have no use or interest in "smart" spektrum stuff.

 

[SrC]

Current RTR electrics are what they are. The legacy BLX ESC's and Motors were the same. Had many of those. Maybe just me, even though I had my Noto ESC fire up and total out the Rig. (HH repaired all) on its first 6s run, and not being alone with this issue, HH solved the bad QC with them and they seemed to improve QC better and was mature production wise. Subsequent Legacy ESC' have been fine. Out of 6 RTR 6s rigs, I warranteed 3 of them. Not including the burned up one. Now the Firma Smart stuff is more bloated, just revamped and marketting Smart hyped for these new RTR electrics.
The piggy backed Cap packs are a disaster. Spectrum failing servos supposedly frying the ESC's. Not for me. Being mostly a kit guy, I currently don't favor most of these Arrma, RTR's any longer. Only the Rollers. I don't know why the Talion was NOT an EXB "Roller". Is it really a deal at their current increased price point?
I say not with the Smart electrics. All else with the Talion seems dead on great. If you want one badly enough, just sell off ALL the electrics out the box and upgrade to better electrics. Many newbs just love the Spektrum gear and prefer to stay with them. Seems like a comfort zone for them. The 2 year warranty seems to count in this regard.
It's like buying a new car, that has a good warranty, just that QC is poor and your car spends much of its time at the dealer for free warranty repair. Being towed back to the dealer when you are broke down and left at the side of the road all the time.
All my upgrade ESC's have been HW Sensored. XR8 plus 6s gear and motors. CC makes great ones also.
FWIW, My MT410 runs great with sensored, as does my Lim. Much more linear power control. ESC parameters just need some dialing in. I like that ability.
My TLRT Typhon is getting the same treatment as I speak.
Just me.

 

[Yonic]

I prefer C hub front ends much more than PB 's on the Arrma's. Better Castor and camber control than the Arrma's.

Why better caser on the c-hub? how do you even change caster on the Tekno?

it's so easy on the arrma cars, but on c-hub cars i understand that you need to change the c-hub to achieve different caster values.

 

[SrC]

Tekno's A and B block Pills can be altered to dial in/out when Full castor angle is achieved throughout ST sweep. Out the box setup by itself has a more refined progressive castor angle scrub setup. Stock Tekno MT C-hub is molded at 15 degrees. Kickup is 10 deg.
Not comparing Arrma to Tekno, what is best. That would not be fair at their respective pricepoints.
Just that The Noto and Tekno MT being same dimensions, have this great difference. Roll center is poor out the box for the Arrma's IMHO. This works against the PB front setup which is too extreme IMHO. Perhaps great for hard bashing. Many don't complain or speak much about this. The front roll center is not fully adjustable. And much more dynamic than rear Roll center. Whereas a C-hub setup is. If the the rear or front is loose, whichever, you can compensate with Rear/ Front roll center changes and change driver input accordingly. That's why Tekno and other track level rigs are much better with On/Off throttle Steering on technical tracks.
The TLRT Typhon Pill setup can adress this better. A first for Arrma. But PB setups are traditionally harder to control with On-Throttle Steering. Harder to hook up.
For bashing purposes not really an issue for most. Just more apparent once you have a higher End rig by comparison.
Hope this made some sense. Beyond the scope of this thread.