Limitless Yet another GT build

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate
links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Agreed, but the overall footprint might be the same or even smaller than the two XLX2’s that are currently required.
Very possible. I'd design the thing to fit on something like the Scorched CF center torsion brace. Otherwise it's just going to take up too much room on the chassis. I guess that would be one of the advantages of using two ESCs is the ability to distribute its footprint a bit more easily. But I do like where your mind is at :)

Although, KT did manage to fit the enormous HW Max4 and 70125 motor AND two 6S packs. So maybe it could work. He's not the most technical person in the world but I do have to give credit where it's due...his solution of moving the steering servo to the splitter was pretty ingenious.
 
I think KT gets a bit of a bad rap just because he’s such a goof. I do like his overall approach to the hobby though. And yeah, I don’t think he’s as dumb as many suggest. My nephew and I enjoy his channel sometimes.
 
Thinking about a build on a Limitless that would use two stock Spektrum 2050kv. And use something like the Roto-lok dual motormount. I think it's only safe as long as the motor can keep up with the ESC timing. If not, the mesh would be too tight and pull a constant unnecessary Amperage. And killing the ESC before the run is over. I would build it as an everyday basher going to about 90 mph.

So is it a dumb project to use uncencored motors in a dual setup?

 
Thinking about a build on a Limitless that would use two stock Spektrum 2050kv. And use something like the Roto-lok dual motormount. I think it's only safe as long as the motor can keep up with the ESC timing. If not, the mesh would be too tight and pull a constant unnecessary Amperage. And killing the ESC before the run is over. I would build it as an everyday basher going to about 90 mph.

So is it a dumb project to use uncencored motors in a dual setup?

That’s a good question and one I’ve wondered myself. I don’t know what the deviation would be between the two motors but I doubt they’d be perfectly synched. A lot of people are doing this for speed run cars, but I’m certainly not on that level and won’t even pretend to have that amount of technical experience. I guess if you were running XLX2’s you could see the deviation on the logs. I’d be curious to see them.
 
I think KT gets a bit of a bad rap just because he’s such a goof. I do like his overall approach to the hobby though. And yeah, I don’t think he’s as dumb as many suggest. My nephew and I enjoy his channel sometimes.
Over the course of his Youtube carreer, Keven either accidentally or instinctively stumbled upon the magic formula for popularity when it comes to content creation: Be likeable and entertaining but offer rub that creates a love/hate relationship with two different factions of your audience. Channels without controversy or something that rubs a segment of the viewership the wrong way just don't do as well. If you're not pissing at least a few people off, you're doing it wrong.
The second component is the Youtube equivalent of the three most important qualities in real estate: thumbnails, Thumbnails and THUMBNAILS!

Creating effective thumbnails that draw in the rando scrollers eye who's on a smart phone and watching ½"x½" images zip by is an artform unto itself. That's why he does those retarded wide open mouth pictures of himself. He knows he looks retarded, but that's the point. It's a proven technique to get people to click on your video. Nothing these people do is an accident. There's a mind numbing amount of detail work that goes into making content that appeals to the eye.

But I'm with you 100% man. Kevin is looked down upon by a portion of the RC scene because he's not the most technical wrencher or driver, he's more of an extreme tester of RC vehicles which has the effect of distorting the unassuming consumer's expectations of what people do with RC cars. What KT does with his vehicles isn't exactly normal but, if you think about it, why should it be? He makes a living (and a rather good one I'd say) by making video content. If the food on your table and the roof over your head are contingent upon the number of eyeballs you can attract, this is going to produce a very natural feedback loop between a creator and his audience.

Kevin's no dummy. Anyone who thinks so needs to check his own presumptions. Of course it's also obvious that he's no rocket surgeon. What Kevin has is the perfect IQ for an entrepreneur. Smart enough to come up with ideas and figure out ways to make those ideas reality but not so smart as to get in his own way by overthinking things, spending and excessive amount of time whinging and worrying over what could go wrong, trying to make contingency plans for a million different things that could go wrong, etc.

Two other Youtube channels exemplify/exemplified this approach to content creation: WhistlinDiesel has mastered the artform at a very young age and his success is undeniable. I would even argue that WD got as big as he did because of his haters and not because of his fans. Everything they said he would never be able to do or accomplish...he just took that hate, compressed it and made it the core of what drove him to make it happen. I love that kid, he REALLY gets it.

The other channel that operated in this combination of good planning and just letting things happen was FPS Russia. That guy absolutely nailed it. I guess it helps when your best friend is a gun smith who has/had the requisite licenses to obtain any weapon. If you're not making good content with a source like that...you're doing it wrong. But the luck FPS had in so many situation...you can't plan that 10 or 20lb piece of shrapnel from an exploding truck that only misses you by 2ft or less. As my best friend likes to say: Only ability or only luck is not enough to truly become successful. Only with a combination of the two will you reach new heights.
Thinking about a build on a Limitless that would use two stock Spektrum 2050kv. And use something like the Roto-lok dual motormount. I think it's only safe as long as the motor can keep up with the ESC timing. If not, the mesh would be too tight and pull a constant unnecessary Amperage. And killing the ESC before the run is over. I would build it as an everyday basher going to about 90 mph.

So is it a dumb project to use uncencored motors in a dual setup?

It doesn't matter whether you're using sensored systems or not. That would only be relevant if you had a way of driving two motors from a single ESC (or two ESCs in one case that are somehow sync'd). No two motors are going to be exactly the same, you're never going to have two motors that are spinning at the same rate. If you look at data logs from people running dual motors, you'll see not so insignificant discrepancies in RPM, current, and so forth.

I'm not trying to dissuade you from trying your hand at a dual motor build, but it might sound like I am. I'm sure it would be a fun experience, but I think my first question would be: what will that dual motor build do for you that you cannot accomplish with a single motor build? Have you maxed out your limitless with a single motor config? if your aim is to make the car unnecessarily complicated for the sheer sake of making it complicated and because you can, don't let me stop you. Dual motor builds really don't make sense unless you're really pushing the envelope of what is possible with a single motor build. If you look at the difference between single and dual motor builds, you're typically talking about a performance/speed gain somewhere in the vicinity of 1-3%. That's a lot of extra money for not much return for what you're investing (I get it, you probably have extra components lying around at home and are thinking of projects where you can employ them so, technically, you're not spending money). I'm just saying that the performance gain on dual motor cars isn't exactly overwhelming. Single motor cars can go so fast these days, they've made dual motor builds something reserved for the 0.1% or people who have money to burn. For 99.9% of the speed runners out there, a single motor build is capable of going faster than they can keep on the ground or in one piece.

The Roto-Lock is a thing of beauty, I'm going to drop one into my VTE as well (just a single motor though ;-). I don't understand what you mean however where you're talking about gear mesh being too tight if the motor can't keep up with the ESC timing? Not sure how those two things fit together.

I'm curious to see how you're going to get all that under the shell of a Limitless. Please be sure to make a build thread :)
That’s a good question and one I’ve wondered myself. I don’t know what the deviation would be between the two motors but I doubt they’d be perfectly synched. A lot of people are doing this for speed run cars, but I’m certainly not on that level and won’t even pretend to have that amount of technical experience. I guess if you were running XLX2’s you could see the deviation on the logs. I’d be curious to see them.
If you look at some of vwturbowolf's logs on his dual motor builds, they're definitely not sync'd. There's quite a bit of deviation going on. Furthermore, the data logging isn't exact. The number are roughly in the ballpark, but I'd be amazed if the RPM reading were even correct to the nearest hundred. The nearest thousand is probably more likely.
 
Last edited:
Over the course of his Youtube carreer, Keven either accidentally or instinctively stumbled upon the magic formula for popularity when it comes to content creation: Be likeable and entertaining but offer rub that creates a love/hate relationship with two different factions of your audience. Channels without controversy or something that rubs a segment of the viewership the wrong way just don't do as well. If you're not pissing at least a few people off, you're doing it wrong.
The second component is the Youtube equivalent of the three most important qualities in real estate: thumbnails, Thumbnails and THUMBNAILS!

Creating effective thumbnails that draw in the rando scrollers eye who's on a smart phone and watching ½"x½" images zip by is an artform unto itself. That's why he does those retarded wide open mouth pictures of himself. He knows he looks retarded, but that's the point. It's a proven technique to get people to click on your video. Nothing these people do is an accident. There's a mind numbing amount of detail work that goes into making content that appeals to the eye.

But I'm with you 100% man. Kevin is looked down upon by a portion of the RC scene because he's not the most technical wrencher or driver, he's more of an extreme tester of RC vehicles which has the effect of distorting the unassuming consumer's expectations of what people do with RC cars. What KT does with his vehicles isn't exactly normal but, if you think about it, why should it be? He makes a living (and a rather good one I'd say) by making video content. If the food on your table and the roof over your head are contingent upon the number of eyeballs you can attract, this is going to produce a very natural feedback loop between a creator and his audience.

Kevin's no dummy. Anyone who thinks so needs to check his own presumptions. Of course it's also obvious that he's no rocket surgeon. What Kevin has is the perfect IQ for an entrepreneur. Smart enough to come up with ideas and figure out ways to make those ideas reality but not so smart as to get in his own way by overthinking things, spending and excessive amount of time whinging and worrying over what could go wrong, trying to make contingency plans for a million different things that could go wrong, etc.

Two other Youtube channels exemplify/exemplified this approach to content creation: WhistlinDiesel has mastered the artform at a very young age and his success is undeniable. I would even argue that WD got as big as he did because of his haters and not because of his fans. Everything they said he would never be able to do or accomplish...he just took that hate, compressed it and made it the core of what drove him to make it happen. I love that kid, he REALLY gets it.

The other channel that operated in this combination of good planning and just letting things happen was FPS Russia. That guy absolutely nailed it. I guess it helps when your best friend is a gun smith who has/had the requisite licenses to obtain any weapon. If you're not making good content with a source like that...you're doing it wrong. But the luck FPS had in so many situation...you can't plan that 10 or 20lb piece of shrapnel from an exploding truck that only misses you by 2ft or less. As my best friend likes to say: Only ability or only luck is not enough to truly become successful. Only with a combination of the two will you reach new heights.

It doesn't matter whether you're using sensored systems or not. That would only be relevant if you had a way of driving two motors from a single ESC (or two ESCs in one case that are somehow sync'd). No two motors are going to be exactly the same, you're never going to have two motors that are spinning at the same rate. If you look at data logs from people running dual motors, you'll see not so insignificant discrepancies in RPM, current, and so forth.

I'm not trying to dissuade you from trying your hand at a dual motor build, but it might sound like I am. I'm sure it would be a fun experience, but I think my first question would be: what will that dual motor build do for you that you cannot accomplish with a single motor build? Have you maxed out your limitless with a single motor config? if your aim is to make the car unnecessarily complicated for the sheer sake of making it complicated and because you can, don't let me stop you. Dual motor builds really don't make sense unless you're really pushing the envelope of what is possible with a single motor build. If you look at the difference between single and dual motor builds, you're typically talking about a performance/speed gain somewhere in the vicinity of 1-3%. That's a lot of extra money for not much return for what you're investing (I get it, you probably have extra components lying around at home and are thinking of projects where you can employ them so, technically, you're not spending money). I'm just saying that the performance gain on dual motor cars isn't exactly overwhelming. Single motor cars can go so fast these days, they've made dual motor builds something reserved for the 0.1% or people who have money to burn. For 99.9% of the speed runners out there, a single motor build is capable of going faster than they can keep on the ground or in one piece.

The Roto-Lock is a thing of beauty, I'm going to drop one into my VTE as well (just a single motor though ;-). I don't understand what you mean however where you're talking about gear mesh being too tight if the motor can't keep up with the ESC timing? Not sure how those two things fit together.

I'm curious to see how you're going to get all that under the shell of a Limitless. Please be sure to make a build thread :)

If you look at some of vwturbowolf's logs on his dual motor builds, they're definitely not sync'd. There's quite a bit of deviation going on. Furthermore, the data logging isn't exact. The number are roughly in the ballpark, but I'd be amazed if the RPM reading were even correct to the nearest hundred. The nearest thousand is probably more likely.
One thing to remember is every motor is hand wound. There will be some kv difference between the same motors,
I bought 3 4070cm motors that were 2200kv on the motor, and one was 2290kv, one 2202, and one 2220.

Also the logs I posted after the initial 191 crash showed a large gap between the motors as far as the logs went and I couldn’t figure out why. I questioned whether the one motor was damaged in the crash.
It took a second crash to expose the issue where two motor bullets looked visible ok when I inspected them but ended up being messed up. The wires almost pulled themseves out of the solder. So it was broken inside from the esc ejecting out of the car.
When I got the car back out for a late 4 and 6s pass the numbers were very close again.
Not perfect but within 100 watts
 
One thing to remember is every motor is hand wound. There will be some kv difference between the same motors,
I bought 3 4070cm motors that were 2200kv on the motor, and one was 2290kv, one 2202, and one 2220.

Also the logs I posted after the initial 191 crash showed a large gap between the motors as far as the logs went and I couldn’t figure out why. I questioned whether the one motor was damaged in the crash.
It took a second crash to expose the issue where two motor bullets looked visible ok when I inspected them but ended up being messed up. The wires almost pulled themseves out of the solder. So it was broken inside from the esc ejecting out of the car.
When I got the car back out for a late 4 and 6s pass the numbers were very close again.
Not perfect but within 100 watts
Thanks for the update. Good to hear that there was actually something physically wrong that was causing the anomalous logs (well...not "good" as a motor was damaged, but good in the sense that there's a reasonable explanation and not being left thinking that motors could run that out of whack and what you could even do about that).
 
It doesn't matter whether you're using sensored systems or not. That would only be relevant if you had a way of driving two motors from a single ESC (or two ESCs in one case that are somehow sync'd). No two motors are going to be exactly the same, you're never going to have two motors that are spinning at the same rate. If you look at data logs from people running dual motors, you'll see not so insignificant discrepancies in RPM, current, and so forth.

I'm not trying to dissuade you from trying your hand at a dual motor build, but it might sound like I am. I'm sure it would be a fun experience, but I think my first question would be: what will that dual motor build do for you that you cannot accomplish with a single motor build? Have you maxed out your limitless with a single motor config? if your aim is to make the car unnecessarily complicated for the sheer sake of making it complicated and because you can, don't let me stop you. Dual motor builds really don't make sense unless you're really pushing the envelope of what is possible with a single motor build. If you look at the difference between single and dual motor builds, you're typically talking about a performance/speed gain somewhere in the vicinity of 1-3%. That's a lot of extra money for not much return for what you're investing (I get it, you probably have extra components lying around at home and are thinking of projects where you can employ them so, technically, you're not spending money). I'm just saying that the performance gain on dual motor cars isn't exactly overwhelming. Single motor cars can go so fast these days, they've made dual motor builds something reserved for the 0.1% or people who have money to burn. For 99.9% of the speed runners out there, a single motor build is capable of going faster than they can keep on the ground or in one piece.

The Roto-Lock is a thing of beauty, I'm going to drop one into my VTE as well (just a single motor though ;-). I don't understand what you mean however where you're talking about gear mesh being too tight if the motor can't keep up with the ESC timing? Not sure how those two things fit together.

I'm curious to see how you're going to get all that under the shell of a Limitless. Please be sure to make a build thread :)

If you look at some of vwturbowolf's logs on his dual motor builds, they're definitely not sync'd. There's quite a bit of deviation going on. Furthermore, the data logging isn't exact. The number are roughly in the ballpark, but I'd be amazed if the RPM reading were even correct to the nearest hundred. The nearest thousand is probably more likely.

Thanks for the input, very helpful.
Here some thoughts. I guess others will have come to the same conclusions before me.

There is little reason to use two motors unless one drives the front and one the rear. Building with two motors was a thought because of motors and ESCs I already have. Does not really make sense. Was looking at the price of an XLX2 and motor and had no joyful feelings. :ROFLMAO:;):p That's where the thought of using existing motors came in.

One motor (2) going little slower basically means that this motor (2) will act as a brake after a few hundred meters of driving. Instead of it pushing the spur it is now slowing it down. ESC of motor (1) is now working to turn the spur and has to overcome the force of pinion (2) as it's motor is turning slower.

So motor 1 or 2 will miss timing when it is just pushed over a pole (before the impulse) by the other motor resulting in more force against each other. Or the braking force being made smaller (good) depending on which motor is missing an impuls when it's pushed over a pole (unsensored motor). ESC burning is basically preprogrammed if a motor can't keep up with the ESC.

On top of that - one ESC shutting down before another, because of heat, will probably result in the other ESC burning within seconds.

Add on top the little difference in voltage of two different 6s lipos and after a short while one pinion (1) is pushing and the other one going too slow with the spur pushing the pinion (2). One battery for both motors would be helpful but the C-rate not playing along.

So the key for speed is two larger motors separately driving the front and rear instead of two dual setups. And the front one beeing a bit faster for stability.

Have not seen vwturbowolf's logs. I guess I'm best off using a MAX6 1650kv and a top speed of 140km/h to have a nice mix of some speed, drifting and bashing.
 
Thanks for the input, very helpful.
Here some thoughts. I guess others will have come to the same conclusions before me.

There is little reason to use two motors unless one drives the front and one the rear. Building with two motors was a thought because of motors and ESCs I already have. Does not really make sense. Was looking at the price of an XLX2 and motor and had no joyful feelings. :ROFLMAO:;):p That's where the thought of using existing motors came in.

One motor (2) going little slower basically means that this motor (2) will act as a brake after a few hundred meters of driving. Instead of it pushing the spur it is now slowing it down. ESC of motor (1) is now working to turn the spur and has to overcome the force of pinion (2) as it's motor is turning slower.

So motor 1 or 2 will miss timing when it is just pushed over a pole (before the impulse) by the other motor resulting in more force against each other. Or the braking force being made smaller (good) depending on which motor is missing an impuls when it's pushed over a pole (unsensored motor). ESC burning is basically preprogrammed if a motor can't keep up with the ESC.

On top of that - one ESC shutting down before another, because of heat, will probably result in the other ESC burning within seconds.

Add on top the little difference in voltage of two different 6s lipos and after a short while one pinion (1) is pushing and the other one going too slow with the spur pushing the pinion (2). One battery for both motors would be helpful but the C-rate not playing along.

So the key for speed is two larger motors separately driving the front and rear instead of two dual setups. And the front one beeing a bit faster for stability.

Have not seen vwturbowolf's logs. I guess I'm best off using a MAX6 1650kv and a top speed of 140km/h to have a nice mix of some speed, drifting and bashing.
Cool man, look forward to seeing your build :)
 
Winter - too cold to spraypaint a body.... :cautious:
Too smelly inside. Done it before, not again.
Will take some time...
Nah, you can spray in the winter too. Just pre-warm the body with a blow dryer or space heater before you lay down a coat of paint. Works well enough for me. That's not to say you shouldn't stick to best practices and test the paint your shooting on a piece of scrap before hitting the body. Lay down light coats and it's really not a problem. At least not for what I do.
 
Thanks for the input, very helpful.
Here some thoughts. I guess others will have come to the same conclusions before me.

There is little reason to use two motors unless one drives the front and one the rear. Building with two motors was a thought because of motors and ESCs I already have. Does not really make sense. Was looking at the price of an XLX2 and motor and had no joyful feelings. :ROFLMAO:;):p That's where the thought of using existing motors came in.

One motor (2) going little slower basically means that this motor (2) will act as a brake after a few hundred meters of driving. Instead of it pushing the spur it is now slowing it down. ESC of motor (1) is now working to turn the spur and has to overcome the force of pinion (2) as it's motor is turning slower.

So motor 1 or 2 will miss timing when it is just pushed over a pole (before the impulse) by the other motor resulting in more force against each other. Or the braking force being made smaller (good) depending on which motor is missing an impuls when it's pushed over a pole (unsensored motor). ESC burning is basically preprogrammed if a motor can't keep up with the ESC.

On top of that - one ESC shutting down before another, because of heat, will probably result in the other ESC burning within seconds.

Add on top the little difference in voltage of two different 6s lipos and after a short while one pinion (1) is pushing and the other one going too slow with the spur pushing the pinion (2). One battery for both motors would be helpful but the C-rate not playing along.

So the key for speed is two larger motors separately driving the front and rear instead of two dual setups. And the front one beeing a bit faster for stability.

Have not seen vwturbowolf's logs. I guess I'm best off using a MAX6 1650kv and a top speed of 140km/h to have a nice mix of some speed, drifting and bashing.
You are on the right track. Most of what you are saying here is why I built my dual motor GT the way I did.
Raz's build highlights that at a certain RPM range, at least dual 1721 2400kv motors do not like being directly connected. There are some unanswered questions. I don't know how Raz phases his motors. Don't know if he energizes a pole to phase lock and sync them that way. But with my limited knowledge it stands to reason that it could also just be too much noise in the gears. Or if you read about how speed controllers work - it could just be that there is a point where one speed controller gets confused.
Mike's build has the two motors that aren't connected. His issue is that the car fights itself. He's been tuning it out - not sure how but presumable with gearing.
So my whole thought was to connect the front and the rear motor with a differential. That should allow both motors to breath and dictate their own timing. I'm expecting even with a fluid connector between the two halves that I'll see some power consumption differences. And gearing up whichever half is what I'm planning on until I get to a 55/45 front/rear power bias.
Its a fun challenge, and if you already have stuff laying around - give it a rip.
 
So my whole thought was to connect the front and the rear motor with a differential. That should allow both motors to breath and dictate their own timing. I'm expecting even with a fluid connector between the two halves that I'll see some power consumption differences. And gearing up whichever half is what I'm planning on until I get to a 55/45 front/rear power bias.

Have not given much thought to the front and rear motor connected with a differential. Obviously they could not drive the same spur on the differential as that would result in the problems mentioned above. Here some thoughts:

Could be tricky getting all that on a chassis. Unless it's connected via some pinions and spurs. That would then result the rear motor trying to give more energy to the differential as the friction from the road is higher in the rear. The differential would send rear energy to the front resulting in front tires ballooning. Unless the oil or silicon plugs in the differential are so thick so they prevent that. If the oil in the differential would be very thick it may be possible to even consumption differences. I don't think the silikon plugs are enough.

Seems to me the best solution is a really fat motor. Like a long one or two kilo brushless TP motor with a pretty high KV. Don't think anything like that is exisiting. If one side on the chassis would be one long motor driving the spool which would be installed just before the rear differential with a very short driveshaft. On the other side of the spool it would need a long driveshaft. Probably supported by some bearings. I think two motors are mostly used as there is no single existing motor that could give the power of those two. Like two Mamba 1717 would be 1,2 Kilo. So if you had a long motor like two, three or four 1717 in line that could be interesting if the shaft is stable enough. It would probably have to be with a higher diameter to keep the shaft from vibrating. Or a 15mm diameter shaft inside the motor that is only 8mm outside the motor. That's just something the manufacturers would have to pick up and test if feasable. The money in the market is definitely there. If something like that were around I guess dual motor setups would become less interesting.

And the other thing is the limits the tires set. Very budget intensive. Tire failure is expensive.
Extra long chassis might be necessary.
 
Last edited:
Car is already built. You can jump back to page 1 to see the build. Be ready for testing in the spring. Almost everything is off the shelf except for the modifications required to build the center spool/diff. Scorched GT chassis just needed one extra set of holes drilled. Will obviously not be running on hoons.
We'll have to see which half of the car is running more power. Mike (the dual motor guy with the divorced driveline) was saying on his car there was something like 30% more power going to the front with everything else being the same. The F100 body makes a lot of front downforce. The differential should force the car to bias power, so what I'm expecting to see (with the same spur gearing front and rear) is more like a 15% difference in amp draw. So the idea is that I should be able to get the front/rear pretty close together via gearing changes. I will just have to monitor closely since the faster the car gets the more drift in amp draw there will probably be. Gear selection is somewhat limited due to the range I can run on the diff (i think down to 33 tooth maybe - have to check) - But everything I need to hit my target speed is available.
Initial testing will be with 500k in the center diff. Where I go from there will just depend on what the car does. But I figured 500k was a good start point. If the front of the car does start to lift it should (in theory) help by pulling power from the rear. I know at high speed once an aero blow over happens there isn't any stopping it. Might experiment with a gyro and some flaps later on to try to counter blow overs.

But - this is where the car is right now. Still need the XLX2's. Then I can see how much real estate I've got for batteries. Where I'm at right now is 4 SMC 8600s because they fit end to end down the side of the chassis. Not sure if Onyx has a comparable pack yet - haven't looked. If I've got the room, I can go with bigger packs side by side. Just not sure yet.

LM6.jpg

LM4.jpg

LM5.jpg

LM3.jpg

LM2.jpg

LM1.jpg


Have not given much thought to the front and rear motor connected with a differential. Obviously they could not drive the same spur on the differential as that would result in the problems mentioned above. Here some thoughts:

Could be tricky getting all that on a chassis. Unless it's connected via some pinions and spurs. That would then result the rear motor trying to give more energy to the differential as the friction from the road is higher in the rear. The differential would send rear energy to the front resulting in front tires ballooning. Unless the oil or silicon plugs in the differential are so thick so they prevent that. If the oil in the differential would be very thick it may be possible to even consumption differences. I don't think the silikon plugs are enough.

Seems to me the best solution is a really fat motor. Like a long one or two kilo brushless TP motor with a pretty high KV. Don't think anything like that is exisiting. If one side on the chassis would be one long motor driving the spool which would be installed just before the rear differential with a very short driveshaft. On the other side of the spool it would need a long driveshaft. Probably supported by some bearings. I think two motors are mostly used as there is no single existing motor that could give the power of those two. Like two Mamba 1717 would be 1,2 Kilo. So if you had a long motor like two, three or four 1717 in line that could be interesting if the shaft is stable enough. It would probably have to be with a higher diameter to keep the shaft from vibrating. Or a 15mm diameter shaft inside the motor that is only 8mm outside the motor. That's just something the manufacturers would have to pick up and test if feasable. The money in the market is definitely there. If something like that were around I guess dual motor setups would become less interesting.

And the other thing is the limits the tires set. Very budget intensive. Tire failure is expensive.
Extra long chassis might be necessary.
 
That's really cool! Very nice the spool in line with the differential. Did not think of that.

What connector is between spool and differential?

Pretty dumb of me not checking out the whole thread.... :unsure: :rolleyes:
 
Last edited:
The ESCs "feel" harmonics and feedback from the other motor. The ESC thinks this is some issue with the motor and can dial back the power.
Could that be resolved by eliminating the sensor wires and running “senseless?”
 
Its caused by running sensorless. When you run dual motor/ESC you don't run the sensor. Not 100% sure why, guessing the speed controllers get even more mad with the sensor.
Each ESC is measuring the pulses from the motor to figure out when to send it electricity. When another connected motor is dragging or pushing the other, it looks like there is a point (RPM) where the processor in the ESC just can't keep up, or that ESC ends up being flat out wrong. So one motor just can't keep timing. It seems that its manifesting on higher KV dual motor builds in a critical failure of one motor - but I imagine the condition is present on lower KV dual motor cars, too. Just not manifesting in a failure.

Could that be resolved by eliminating the sensor wires and running “senseless?”
 
Been a while so I thought I'd drop a build update.
Everything is in the car at this point. The only things not pictured are the gyro and perfect pass.
I opted to mount my servo on the top deck to free up some room. I need to have my bellcrank modified to sit up a little higher for battery clearance. When that's done these 9500's should fit nicely. Can't really see it in the pictures, but I have lights mounted. Pretty clean install on the rear - its a variable pattern LED bar controlled by the radio.
Time for final wiring, power up, programming, and bench testing.
Nice clean install of the signal booster on the radio. All wiring is internal with minimal modifications to the radio body so it can be undone. Power wire goes through the handle to a step down converter in the base. Runs on one battery. Not sure if I've seen anyone do a 10px this clean.

Anxious to see how this center driveline performs. My spur gear selection is limited. 40 is as small as I can go on the diff side. If this doesn't work, it'll end up being a dual 2028 car.
Now just a lot of crimping to do to shorten up some servo leads. Get bullets soldered on the ESC's and it can power up.

333243979_861992518233807_2402893869828850696_n.jpg


side1.jpg


side2.jpg


radio.jpg
 
Been a while so I thought I'd drop a build update.
Everything is in the car at this point. The only things not pictured are the gyro and perfect pass.
I opted to mount my servo on the top deck to free up some room. I need to have my bellcrank modified to sit up a little higher for battery clearance. When that's done these 9500's should fit nicely. Can't really see it in the pictures, but I have lights mounted. Pretty clean install on the rear - its a variable pattern LED bar controlled by the radio.
Time for final wiring, power up, programming, and bench testing.
Nice clean install of the signal booster on the radio. All wiring is internal with minimal modifications to the radio body so it can be undone. Power wire goes through the handle to a step down converter in the base. Runs on one battery. Not sure if I've seen anyone do a 10px this clean.

Anxious to see how this center driveline performs. My spur gear selection is limited. 40 is as small as I can go on the diff side. If this doesn't work, it'll end up being a dual 2028 car.
Now just a lot of crimping to do to shorten up some servo leads. Get bullets soldered on the ESC's and it can power up.

View attachment 284101

View attachment 284102

View attachment 284103

View attachment 284104

Nice build.
I like the servo layout. I will be doing the same on my VTE2 once I swap to the dual motor setup.
 
Old Thread: Hello . There have been no replies in this thread for 90 days.
Content in this thread may no longer be relevant.
Perhaps it would be better to start a new thread instead.
Back
Top