Kraton 4985 vs 4990

[NitroK]

Planning to upgrade my kraton motor and esc. Its got the m2c chassis, shock tower and f/r brace. How does the new max 6 G2 sensored 4990 1650kv compare to the old max 6 4985?

Would sensored would be a better option as I mostly just want to bash. Aliexpress has the rocket v2 160A esc and 4985 1680kv combo..has anybody tried it?

 

[parcou]

Planning to upgrade my kraton motor and esc. Its got the m2c chassis, shock tower and f/r brace. How does the new max 6 G2 sensored 4990 1650kv compare to the old max 6 4985?

Would sensored would be a better option as I mostly just want to bash. Aliexpress has the rocket v2 160A esc and 4985 1680kv combo..has anybody tried it?

Hello and Welcome!

I cannot speak to the new motor, but I do have the old combo... Bashing, I do not see the cost or need for sensored, although you can do it. Bashing you are not really concerned with clogging you could see at slower movements. Most are 0-100 on the throttle pull. Just make sure you are geared right for your power setup.

I could be dead wrong if there is an advantage, so let's see how those replies that may have sensored setup for a Kraton.

 

[Shadows]

Planning to upgrade my kraton motor and esc. Its got the m2c chassis, shock tower and f/r brace. How does the new max 6 G2 sensored 4990 1650kv compare to the old max 6 4985?

Would sensored would be a better option as I mostly just want to bash. Aliexpress has the rocket v2 160A esc and 4985 1680kv combo..has anybody tried it?

I agree with parcou. Plus, I'd stay away from any ESC other than Hobbywing, Castle, and Tekin. If you wanted to possibly run 8s, I'd go with Hobbywing's 4990 sensored system. Otherwise, the less expensive Hobbywing 4985 Max 6 combo will do the job and do it well on 6s. To run 8s, you could also run a basic (non sensored) Hobbywing Max 6 with a Rocket motor of a lower KV like a 1250kv to 1480kv 4092, or their 1550kv 4585 motor. Their motors are okay enough, just not the ESC's.

 

[NitroK]

I agree with parcou. Plus, I'd stay away from any ESC other than Hobbywing, Castle, and Tekin. If you wanted to possibly run 8s, I'd go with Hobbywing's 4990 sensored system. Otherwise, the less expensive Hobbywing 4985 Max 6 combo will do the job and do it well on 6s. To run 8s, you could also run a basic (non sensored) Hobbywing Max 6 with a Rocket motor of a lower KV like a 1250kv to 1480kv 4092, or their 1550kv 4585 motor. Their motors are okay enough, just not the ESC's.

8s for bashing on a kraton will be insane power. Going to wait for feedback on how the new max 6 G2 is performing. Bluetooth connectivity for the new ESC is a nice feature but will it last.

Hello and Welcome!

I cannot speak to the new motor, but I do have the old combo... Bashing, I do not see the cost or need for sensored, although you can do it. Bashing you are not really concerned with clogging you could see at slower movements. Most are 0-100 on the throttle pull. Just make sure you are geared right for your power setup.

I could be dead wrong if there is an advantage, so let's see how those replies that may have sensored setup for a Kraton.

Agreed. Not converting my kraton into a crawler. Lets wait for the reviews on the new motor before making an informed decision.

 

[Saladshooter]

8s for bashing on a kraton will be insane power.

I have a Max 6 / 4985 Combo in my Outcast. Honestly it's ridiculous on 6s. I have the punch dialed back and a gentler throttle curve programed into the TX to keep the wheels down until I want to blip the throttle to achieve lift-off.

Your Kraton can handle more energy on the ground before losing grip on the front wheels. But both 6s/8s will take a huge toll on your drivetrain unless you are good at the throttle. All part of the fun.

 

[Shadows]

I wasn't suggesting running 8s, only that the new G2 is more capable of it. For bashing, sensored isn't necessary. Some bashers steer clear of it in apprehension about it's durability during the jarring abuse that can happen. But, if Bluetooth appeals to you, then maybe the G2 is worth the consideration. Main thing is to avoid the unproven brand of ESC.

 

[dgitalchaos]

I’ve had both the Max 6 V3 with the 4985 and the Max 6 G2 with the 4990 G2. I’ve had them in the Infraction and XRT. If you can afford it, 100% go with the Max 6 G2 combo. I’ve pushed the limits of the Max 6 V3 4985 combo to 120MPH in the Infraction and the XRT to 68MPH with the 4985 1650kv motor. The Max 6 V3 combo heated up the ECS in both applications to thermal protection after a few runs back and forth. The motor got to 140° external temp on the Infraction, and 160°F external temp on the XRT.

The Max 6 G2 got to 146° internal temp (based of the logged data) running two sets of batteries in the XRT (120°F external) and the motor got to 176°F internal (125° external) , whereas the internal is also based on the data log. The Max 6 v3 is a 160A ESC and the Max 6 G2 is a 200A ESC. This makes a massive difference in cooling.

Plus the sensored motors just run cooler as well and have a smoother feel.

Don’t get me wrong, the Max 6V3 and 4985 1650kv combo runs awesome in the Fireteam and propels it like a rocket with 21/50 gearing. Certainly much better than stock, but for about $30 more than the Max 6 V3, you get a higher amp ESC, Bluetooth adjustability, better cooling, sensored operation, and a cooler running motor - which has also been waterproofed with seals on the back plate and front bearing.

 

[CosmoM3]

I have both G1 (unsensored with the 4985 1650kv) and the G2 (sensored with the 4990SD 1650kv).

If you’re bashing it, I really see no reason of going with the newer sensored setup that’s on the G2. That being said, it comes with extra features like bluetooth, better heat management and of course sensored. I kind of regret getting the nicer G2 on the Kraton 6S EXB since the sensored setup isn’t noticeable at all while you’re bashing it. Sure the newer one runs up to 200A now and has better cooling, but nothing a cheap Amazon fan mount can’t fix with the G1.

It’s all about price: just get the one that’s the cheapest. They don’t make the G1 anymore but if you see one for a cheap price, I would snag it up.

I have the following setups with the Max6:

• Limitless V2 (Max6 G2) - approx 13lbs fully loaded
  • worth it to me for that very low speed control on what would be a cogging beast with a 34-38T pinion and stock 39T spool
• Kraton 6S EXB (Max6 G2) - approx 13lbs fully loaded
  • Not worth it at all and save your money and go with the unsensored motor. Even the stock Spektrum 2050kv is fine and excellent for this rig.
• Fireteam (Max6 G1) - approx 15-16lbs fully loaded
  • This is about perfect as the heaviest of the 6S series. I had the stock 2050kv (good and plenty), Max8 G2 2250kv (not faster but just sensored) and now the Max6 G1 1650kv (just right on both 4S and 6S).

 

[NitroK]

I’ve had both the Max 6 V3 with the 4985 and the Max 6 G2 with the 4990 G2. I’ve had them in the Infraction and XRT. If you can afford it, 100% go with the Max 6 G2 combo. I’ve pushed the limits of the Max 6 V3 4985 combo to 120MPH in the Infraction and the XRT to 68MPH with the 4985 1650kv motor. The Max 6 V3 combo heated up the ECS in both applications to thermal protection after a few runs back and forth. The motor got to 140° external temp on the Infraction, and 160°F external temp on the XRT.

The Max 6 G2 got to 146° internal temp (based of the logged data) running two sets of batteries in the XRT (120°F external) and the motor got to 176°F internal (125° external) , whereas the internal is also based on the data log. The Max 6 v3 is a 160A ESC and the Max 6 G2 is a 200A ESC. This makes a massive difference in cooling.

Plus the sensored motors just run cooler as well and have a smoother feel.

Don’t get me wrong, the Max 6V3 and 4985 1650kv combo runs awesome in the Fireteam and propels it like a rocket with 21/50 gearing. Certainly much better than stock, but for about $30 more than the Max 6 V3, you get a higher amp ESC, Bluetooth adjustability, better cooling, sensored operation, and a cooler running motor - which has also been waterproofed with seals on the back plate and front bearing.

Thank you for the data. Keeping the esc and motor cool was a major concern. It does not cost much more to purchase the max6 g2 combo. Do it once and do it right.

 

[cazrack]

The new Max 6 g2 will probably be fine in a Arrma 1/5 Kraton/Outcast as well, you can always move it to a bigger RC.
The original Max6 sure its fine in the Xmaxx and XRT but using it hard on throttle with 1/5 Kraton and 1/5 Outcast nah its gonna overheat to easy.

If the RC can fit the new 5690sd motor with higher gearing it can later be moved to bigger 1/5 as well and probably be the better choice than a 4990sd motor in such a big RC.

I think we are in a situation where you want to buy a RC roller more then ever since you may want the G2 stuff.
I will probably buy the Kagama roller and put my fireteam stock esc/motor in it.

 

[NitroK]

I have both G1 (unsensored with the 4985 1650kv) and the G2 (sensored with the 4990SD 1650kv).

If you’re bashing it, I really see no reason of going with the newer sensored setup that’s on the G2. That being said, it comes with extra features like bluetooth, better heat management and of course sensored. I kind of regret getting the nicer G2 on the Kraton 6S EXB since the sensored setup isn’t noticeable at all while you’re bashing it. Sure the newer one runs up to 200A now and has better cooling, but nothing a cheap Amazon fan mount can’t fix with the G1.

It’s all about price: just get the one that’s the cheapest. They don’t make the G1 anymore but if you see one for a cheap price, I would snag it up.

I have the following setups with the Max6:

• Limitless V2 (Max6 G2)
  • worth it to me for that very low speed control on what would be a cogging beast with a 34-38T pinion and stock 39T spool
• Kraton 6S EXB (Max6 G2)
  • Not worth it at all and save your money and go with the unsensored motor. Even the stock Spektrum 2050kv is fine and excellent for this rig.
• Fireteam (Max6 G1)
  • This is about perfect as the heaviest of the 6S series. I had the stock 2050kv (good and plenty), Max8 G2 2250kv (not faster but just sensored) and now the Max6 G1 1650kv (just right on both 4S and 6S).

I use the Kraton for bashing and sensored would not be a critical factor but I do like it runs cooler. Stock motor is fine but with all the m2c upgrades, the Kraton need a bit more power. Initially, was considering the max8 option with the 4278 motor...now I am leaning towards the max6 combo

Kraton 6s EXB guys all have the max6 4985 combo and say its a great setup. Most of the time I see them doing unwanted wheeles which unfortunately turns into a backflip when they put the power down. Is is too much power?

Noticed that the max8 combo runs smoother and better to control on the stock Kraton 6s. Due to better vehicle setup, less torque or driver skills, I can't say.

I just want a basher that can handle a few jumps without me breaking into a cold sweat each time I put the power down.

 

[cazrack]

Bigger motor more power for stunts/backflips/frontflips but tires matter as well.
With extreme power you can have non balloning tires for single backflips/frontflips?

Just have to manage throttle during normal driving or better yet get a tx/rx like dumbo rc that you can limit throttle in % to what you want by turning a dial. I use it on my Outcast 8s exb max5 800kv 39:39 works great, have it on 80-85%. when just running it normal.

Well you can limit on spektrum rtr tx but only to 75% and 50% not enough fine tuning.

 

[CosmoM3]

Kraton 6s EXB guys all have the max6 4985 combo and say its a great setup. Most of the time I see them doing unwanted wheeles which unfortunately turns into a backflip when they put the power down. Is is too much power?

Noticed that the max8 combo runs smoother and better to control on the stock Kraton 6s. Due to better vehicle setup, less torque or driver skills, I can't say.

I just want a basher that can handle a few jumps without me breaking into a cold sweat each time I put the power down.

You may have all those M2C parts on it, but I think you underestimate the stock 2050kv’s ability to haul ass on 6S, even the Max8 G2 2250kv.

The Max8 G2 2250kv will feel more controllable (it’s lighter too than the Max6) due to lower torque threshold and I much prefer it for LWB MT and Truggies.

The Max6 G2 1650kv (this is my opinion) is a lot of power for something like the K6S series as it can do standing backflips all day. So much so that it was getting annoying and a chore to keep the wheels down to build speed. I had to lower the punch level because otherwise I was just wasting power, energy and building up heat.

However, you have to remember that the Max6 G2 1650kv combo is actually cheaper than the Max8 G2 2250kv combo right now. Something to consider, but you won’t make full use of all that power since the chassis can’t put all that power down.

These opinions of my own based on my experience (I have almost all the 6S rigs and each are powered by the latest HW Max6-8 setups on all cells). If you want overwhelming power, then take my advice with a grain of salt.

 

[Shadows]

You may have all those M2C parts on it, but I think you underestimate the stock 2050kv’s ability to haul ass on 6S, even the Max8 G2 2250kv.

The Max8 G2 2250kv will feel more controllable (it’s lighter too than the Max6) due to lower torque threshold and I much prefer it for LWB MT and Truggies.

The Max6 G2 1650kv (this is my opinion) is a lot of power for something like the K6S series as it can do standing backflips all day. So much so that it was getting annoying and a chore to keep the wheels down to build speed. I had to lower the punch level because otherwise I was just wasting power, energy and building up heat.

However, you have to remember that the Max6 G2 1650kv combo is actually cheaper than the Max8 G2 2250kv combo right now. Something to consider, but you won’t make full use of all that power since the chassis can’t put all that power down.

These opinions of my own based on my experience (I have almost all the 6S rigs and each are powered by the latest HW Max6-8 setups on all cells). If you want overwhelming power, then take my advice with a grain of salt.

I have a remedy for keeping the front end planted to the ground with my heavy M2C'd EXB K6 on crazy 8s power. One million mixed half with half million fluid in front diff set to full LSD. 100,000 in center set to full LSD, and 50k fluid rear set to minimum LSD. It's like torque vectoring AWD with full time 4WD. It won't wheelie, but it also won't just waste energy by spinning the front tires. Won't fishtail at all. Handles like it's on rails. All the diffs have aluminum cups and bulkheads. Runs a Surpass Rocket 1250kv 4092 with Max 6. 18t pinion with heavy belted tires.

Just to let ya' know that 'big block' type power can be harnessed. So, the Max 6 G2 4990 system would be possible to control, imo. Personally, I'd go for that in an upgraded K6 EXB at this point. Anything with big Max 6 power (even 6s) will need the stronger M2C outdrives and driveshafts. Stock will turn to pretzels. I think it would be worth it. Yeah, 200a ESC. Ya' can't go wrong with staying cooler with that. Better than relying more on expensive higher powered fans. I'd only consider the MAX 8 for a Typhon....but that's me.

 

[NitroK]

The new Max 6 g2 will probably be fine in a Arrma 1/5 Kraton/Outcast as well, you can always move it to a bigger RC.
The original Max6 sure its fine in the Xmaxx and XRT but using it hard on throttle with 1/5 Kraton and 1/5 Outcast nah its gonna overheat to easy.

If the RC can fit the new 5690sd motor with higher gearing it can later be moved to bigger 1/5 as well and probably be the better choice than a 4990sd motor in such a big RC.

I think we are in a situation where you want to buy a RC roller more then ever since you may want the G2 stuff.
I will probably buy the Kagama roller and put my fireteam stock esc/motor in it.

I have a remedy for keeping the front end planted to the ground with my heavy M2C'd EXB K6 on crazy 8s power. One million mixed half with half million fluid in front diff set to full LSD. 100,000 in center set to full LSD, and 50k fluid rear set to minimum LSD. It's like torque vectoring AWD with full time 4WD. It won't wheelie, but it also won't just waste energy by spinning the front tires. Won't fishtail at all. Handles like it's on rails. All the diffs have aluminum cups and bulkheads. Runs a Surpass Rocket 1250kv 4092 with Max 6. 18t pinion with heavy belted tires.

Just to let ya' know that 'big block' type power can be harnessed. So, the Max 6 G2 4990 system would be possible to control, imo. Personally, I'd go for that in an upgraded K6 EXB at this point. Anything with big Max 6 power (even 6s) will need the stronger M2C outdrives and driveshafts. Stock will turn to pretzels. I think it would be worth it. Yeah, 200a ESC. Ya' can't go wrong with staying cooler with that. Better than relying more on expensive higher powered fans. I'd only consider the MAX 8 for a Typhon....but that's me.

I like your plan..this will make it more of a front wheel drive car. Extra power goes to the rear and the thin fluid in center diff keeps the car on the ground. No more understeer. Got to get the proper balance between center and rear diff oil based on each individual car's weight and handling...or all the power gonna go into a single rear tire. 750K in the front diff...how is the turning radius?

The max 6 g2 does not cost lot more compared to the old version. Lots of good stuff in the bundle...lower running temp, bluetooth (may not be a good thing), larger amp ESC, 5mm longer motor. Turn the punch setting down, tweak the throttle curve and should be awesome combo with the kraton 6s.

 

[Garcbomber]

I have a remedy for keeping the front end planted to the ground with my heavy M2C'd EXB K6 on crazy 8s power. One million mixed half with half million fluid in front diff set to full LSD. 100,000 in center set to full LSD, and 50k fluid rear set to minimum LSD. It's like torque vectoring AWD with full time 4WD. It won't wheelie, but it also won't just waste energy by spinning the front tires. Won't fishtail at all. Handles like it's on rails. All the diffs have aluminum cups and bulkheads. Runs a Surpass Rocket 1250kv 4092 with Max 6. 18t pinion with heavy belted tires.

Just to let ya' know that 'big block' type power can be harnessed. So, the Max 6 G2 4990 system would be possible to control, imo. Personally, I'd go for that in an upgraded K6 EXB at this point. Anything with big Max 6 power (even 6s) will need the stronger M2C outdrives and driveshafts. Stock will turn to pretzels. I think it would be worth it. Yeah, 200a ESC. Ya' can't go wrong with staying cooler with that. Better than relying more on expensive higher powered fans. I'd only consider the MAX 8 for a Typhon....but that's me.

No offense to your china/rocket/hobbystar/xteam “4092” as I’ve used a half-dozen of them, but the 200amp combo w/ modern 4990 *hobbyWING is on a completely different pinnacle. Especially on 8S.

I’ve snapped EXB output cups/shafts on 8s not even jumping big, those little 2.25mm pins in 31mm diffs wouldn’t last a minute

 

[Shadows]

No offense to your china/rocket/hobbystar/xteam “4092” as I’ve used a half-dozen of them, but the 200amp combo w/ modern 4990 hobbystar is on a completely different pinnacle. Especially on 8S.

I’ve snapped EXB output cups/shafts on 8s not even jumping big, those little 2.25mm pins in 31mm diffs wouldn’t last a minute

I would agree. I didn't set out to have the best when I bought it. If what I have fails too soon, I would consider the MAX 6 G2 combo. EXB are the 29mm, which is what I upgraded to after nearly replacing all of my V5 K6 with all the upgrades. Used the V5 chassis though for a half budget build with the regular diffs. Acquiring parts now for another half budget build. Typhon into a SCT. V5 chassis. Gonna cut drill blanks that completely fill the holes for the outdrives. They won't be breaking on the lighter SCT. No jumping. Heck, I haven't even jumped my decked out Kraton beyond a foot. I'm a light duty, but hard on acceleration basher so far. No ramp.

 

[CosmoM3]

One million mixed half with half million fluid in front diff set to full LSD. 100,000 in center set to full LSD, and 50k fluid rear set to minimum LSD. It's like torque vectoring AWD with full time 4WD.

I'll actually give this a try on my K6S EXB with the Max6 G2 1650kv (19T/50T).

 

[slick2500]

As mentioned before I would avoid the Surpass escs as they have a track record for burning up rather quickly. They make good motors especially their higher end and sensored motors.