Kraton Kraton EXB rear diff compatible with 6s BLX?

[GiantNinja]

I finally got my Kraton EXB and after a few bashing sessions in the thick florida red clay, I blew my rear diff (sun gears like everyone else apparently). I can't find the parts anywhere (new gear set ARA310985 or the fully assembled ARA311066)

Does anyone know where I could get either the gears or the assebled diff? Or can you drop the rear diff from the 6s BLX (AR220041) in as a temporary solution until parts are more available?

 

[Notorious J]

I finally got my Kraton EXB and after a few bashing sessions in the thick florida red clay, I blew my rear diff (sun gears like everyone else apparently). I can't find the parts anywhere (new gear set ARA310985 or the fully assembled ARA311066)

Does anyone know where I could get either the gears or the assebled diff? Or can you drop the rear diff from the 6s BLX (AR220041) in as a temporary solution until parts are more available?

Quick answer is no. EXB uses wider shafts on the out drives and input pinion. Gears are not interchangeable between the two different cups. Gear boxes are the same, but to use one in the other, you'll have to change the bearings. I put a V4 in my EXB by changing both bearings for the input gear.

 

[GiantNinja]

Quick answer is no. EXB uses wider shafts on the out drives and input pinion. Gears are not interchangeable between the two different cups. Gear boxes are the same, but to use one in the other, you'll have to change the bearings. I put a V4 in my EXB by changing both bearings for the input gear.

Thanks for the quick reply...

So if I were to get a v4 diff (fully assembled, cup and all) it would fit but I'd need some new bearings? Do you know what size or part # ?
I also saw this on ebay:

"Arrma Kraton EXB Rear Differential Spool - Billet Aluminum replaces ARA310985"
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Arrma-Krat...264826917053?_trksid=p2385738.m4383.l4275.c10

Not sure how locking the rear diff would be, but seems like a bunch of people having the same issues with these sun gears breaking

 

[olds97_lss]

Quick answer is no. EXB uses wider shafts on the out drives and input pinion. Gears are not interchangeable between the two different cups. Gear boxes are the same, but to use one in the other, you'll have to change the bearings. I put a V4 in my EXB by changing both bearings for the input gear.

Odd, just checked the parts explosions for the outcast 6s and kraton exb, appears they use the same sized bearings, just the exb has rubber sealed.

Outcast:
AR610016 - 8x16x5 - output bearings
AR610017 - 8x19x6 - pinion large bearing
AR610019 - 5x11x4 - pinion small bearing

EXB:
ARA610037 - 8x16x5 - output bearings
ARA610039 - 8x19x6 - pinion large bearing
ARA610040 - 5x11x4 - pinion small bearing

From what I can tell, they are a direct drop in, but you do have to use both the exb input pinion and diff together because the teeth on the pinion/ring gear differ.

Is the manual wrong or am I missing something? I will likely end up getting the front/rear EXB diffs for my outcast if/when the ring/pinions die again.

 

[Jluther@becoinc]

Odd, just checked the parts explosions for the outcast 6s and kraton exb, appears they use the same sized bearings, just the exb has rubber sealed.

Outcast:
AR610016 - 8x16x5 - output bearings
AR610017 - 8x19x6 - pinion large bearing
AR610019 - 5x11x4 - pinion small bearing

EXB:
ARA610037 - 8x16x5 - output bearings
ARA610039 - 8x19x6 - pinion large bearing
ARA610040 - 5x11x4 - pinion small bearing

From what I can tell, they are a direct drop in, but you do have to use both the exb input pinion and diff together because the teeth on the pinion/ring gear differ.

Is the manual wrong or am I missing something? I will likely end up getting the front/rear EXB diffs for my outcast if/when the ring/pinions die again.

You are right the bearings are the same but you have to change the input gear as well.
I did that on my exb and it worked fine

 

[Notorious J]

Odd, just checked the parts explosions for the outcast 6s and kraton exb, appears they use the same sized bearings, just the exb has rubber sealed.

Outcast:
AR610016 - 8x16x5 - output bearings
AR610017 - 8x19x6 - pinion large bearing
AR610019 - 5x11x4 - pinion small bearing

EXB:
ARA610037 - 8x16x5 - output bearings
ARA610039 - 8x19x6 - pinion large bearing
ARA610040 - 5x11x4 - pinion small bearing

From what I can tell, they are a direct drop in, but you do have to use both the exb input pinion and diff together because the teeth on the pinion/ring gear differ.

Is the manual wrong or am I missing something? I will likely end up getting the front/rear EXB diffs for my outcast if/when the ring/pinions die again.

It might be just the input pinion. I'll confirm when I get home tonight if the out drives are different as well. You definitely need different bearings for the input gear if you want to put EXB into a V4 and vice versa. What I'm getting at, is there is little to no interchangeability between the two. It's either all V4 or all EXB.

 

[olds97_lss]

It might be just the input pinion. I'll confirm when I get home tonight if the out drives are different as well. You definitely need different bearings for the input gear if you want to put EXB into a V4 and vice versa. What I'm getting at, is there is little to no interchangeability between the two. It's either all V4 or all EXB.

The parts explosion shows the input bearings being the same size as previous bearings, just rubber sealed.

 

[Notorious J]

The parts explosion shows the input bearings being the same size as previous bearings, just rubber sealed.

I.D is different, O.D is the same. The new input and ring gear on the EXB is completely different. I just went through this putting the V4 dif in my EXB while I wait for shims from Horizon Hobby

 

[GiantNinja]

I.D is different, O.D is the same. The new input and ring gear on the EXB is completely different. I just went through this putting the V4 dif in my EXB while I wait for shims from Horizon Hobby

So it sounds like it can be done as long as you're also using the correct input shaft? I've seen two different diffs for the Kraton v4 BLX and not sure what the difference is between ARA310957 and AR220041 ? Looks like AR220041 includes the input shaft, but would I need different bearing or would the ones that came with the EXB be ok?

 

[Notorious J]

So it sounds like it can be done as long as you're also using the correct input shaft? I've seen two different diffs for the Kraton v4 BLX and not sure what the difference is between ARA310957 and AR220041 ? Looks like AR220041 includes the input shaft, but would I need different bearing or would the ones that came with the EXB be ok?

The input pinion and ring gear are a different pitch on the EXB as well. You can't mix and match. All of one or all of the other.

 

[GiantNinja]

The input pinion and ring gear are a different pitch on the EXB as well. You can't mix and match. All of one or all of the other.

Right, that's what I was getting at... AR220041 comes with the input pinion to match the BLX ring gear. I ordered it and a few different sized shims, so we'll see how it goes. Just hope I'm not going to need different bearings or something else once it arrives

 

[jondilly1974]

You will need:

V4 input pinion
V4 input cup
V4 ring gear
V4 diff cup
V4 all internal gears, pins, etc, sun and satellite
V4 shims, both types internal plus bearing shims

 

[MrTitanium]

Gear boxes are the same, but to use one in the other, you'll have to change the bearings.

FYI: Bearings are the same as the EXB and V4 diff cases share same part number. All 6s share same diff case (to date).

Edit: EXB uses ARA610039 and ARA610040 bearings while the V4 uses ARA610017 and ARA610019 bearings. Different part numbers but same dimensions. Difference lies that the V4 are metal shielded whereas the EXB uses 2RS (rubber shielded) units.

 

[GiantNinja]

You will need:

V4 input pinion
V4 input cup
V4 ring gear
V4 diff cup
V4 all internal gears, pins, etc, sun and satellite
V4 shims, both types internal plus bearing shims

Thanks for the info. I think it will come with everything I need then (I ordered the shims too). This is what the arrma site says it includes:

INCLUDES:
1 x Differential Case
1 x Diff Case Insert
4 x 10T Satellite Gears
2 x Metal Cross Shafts
2 x Planetary Gears
2 x F/R Diff Outdrives
2 x Diff Pin - 2.25 x 9.8mm=
2 x Silicone O-rings
1 x Diff Gasket
4 x Satellite Gear Shims
4 x Metal Cross Shaft Insert
1 x 10T Input Shaft
1 x 43T Spiral Diff Crown Gear
4 x Button Head Screws M3 x 12mm
1 x Set Screw M4 x 3mm

 

[jondilly1974]

Thanks for the info. I think it will come with everything I need then (I ordered the shims too). This is what the arrma site says it includes:

INCLUDES:
1 x Differential Case
1 x Diff Case Insert
4 x 10T Satellite Gears
2 x Metal Cross Shafts
2 x Planetary Gears
2 x F/R Diff Outdrives
2 x Diff Pin - 2.25 x 9.8mm=
2 x Silicone O-rings
1 x Diff Gasket
4 x Satellite Gear Shims
4 x Metal Cross Shaft Insert
1 x 10T Input Shaft
1 x 43T Spiral Diff Crown Gear
4 x Button Head Screws M3 x 12mm
1 x Set Screw M4 x 3mm

Yep pretty much everything but the diff housing and cover ???

 

[Notorious J]

Okay. @GiantNinja @MrTitanium @olds97_lss and anyone else who is reading this. A week ago, my rear dif went on my EXB. I was like "sh!t. that sucks". Then a lightbulb goes off in my head. Why not just take off the ring gear and install it on a V4 dif. Big nope. The hole diameter was to big. The out drives are not the same. You can't slide a V4 planetary gear on it because the hole is smaller. Same goes for the input pinion. The shaft is wider. So at the very least, the bearing on the outside of the case has to be different. I'm not 100% sure if the inside bearing is the same, but the outside is definitely different. And since the pitch of the input pinion and V4 ring gear are different, I had to switch that too. Pretty sure i had to replace the outer bearing to make it work. Now I'm going to be home in about an hour, and that EXB dif is sitting on my work bench, bearings and all. I will measure everything so we can finally put his to rest. I'm not sure what Arrma is putting up on their website, but I have a feeling there may be some discrepancies that need to be addressed. I am writing this not to be condescending, but only because now I'm truly second guessing everything. Will report shortly.

 

[MrTitanium]

Okay. @GiantNinja @MrTitanium @olds97_lss and anyone else who is reading this. A week ago, my rear dif went on my EXB. I was like "sh!t. that sucks". Then a lightbulb goes off in my head. Why not just take off the ring gear and install it on a V4 dif. Big nope. The hole diameter was to big. The out drives are not the same. You can't slide a V4 planetary gear on it because the hole is smaller. Same goes for the input pinion. The shaft is wider. So at the very least, the bearing on the outside of the case has to be different. I'm not 100% sure if the inside bearing is the same, but the outside is definitely different. And since the pitch of the input pinion and V4 ring gear are different, I had to switch that too. Pretty sure i had to replace the outer bearing to make it work. Now I'm going to be home in about an hour, and that EXB dif is sitting on my work bench, bearings and all. I will measure everything so we can finally put his to rest. I'm not sure what Arrma is putting up on their website, but I have a feeling there may be some discrepancies that need to be addressed. I am writing this not to be condescending, but only because now I'm truly second guessing everything. Will report shortly.

Way ahead of you bud

I had thought about transplanting the EXB gears onto the V4 ARA220050 units but with the help of @jondilly1974, we confirmed bolt patterns and diff cups diameters are very different. Also, the EXB uses 6mm, whereas the V4 uses 5mm diameter shafts. Plus more BS that makes it almost impossible for it to work.

Give it time though as someone out there is designing an aftermarket diff cup for the EXB...

 

[olds97_lss]

I know the cups/gears/internals/outputs are all different and not interchangeable. Was only questioning the bearings. The size of the output shafts where they go into the ring gear and cup has little to do with the bearings as the bearings ride on the ring gear and cup, so they could have just made the wall thinner and still have 8mm OD where the bearing sits. As for the input pinion, I thought they just extended the length of the gear teeth like the ring gear (which forces the cup to be shorter) and made it out of different material. Looking at the parts explosions would suggest that as well since all the bearings are the same ID/OD and the bulkheads are the same.

Will be curious what you find. Would hate to get the diffs for my outcast and find out I don't have bearings to support them.

 

[Notorious J]

I know the cups/gears/internals/outputs are all different and not interchangeable. Was only questioning the bearings. The size of the output shafts where they go into the ring gear and cup has little to do with the bearings as the bearings ride on the ring gear and cup, so they could have just made the wall thinner and still have 8mm OD where the bearing sits. As for the input pinion, I thought they just extended the length of the gear teeth like the ring gear (which forces the cup to be shorter) and made it out of different material. Looking at the parts explosions would suggest that as well since all the bearings are the same ID/OD and the bulkheads are the same.

Will be curious what you find. Would hate to get the diffs for my outcast and find out I don't have bearings to support them.

Alright. @MrTitanium @jondilly1974 and @GiantNinja. I was confused about some things and my memory didn't serve me correctly. @olds97_lss, you are correct. Bearing sizes are the same. And as @MrTitanium noted, the input pinion is identical in size, but the pitch is different. As he also noted, the internal gears, cup, ring gear and out drives are not. The night I did the switch, I was frustrated that I couldn't use the new beefier ring gear and pinion on my old dif, which left the impression that there were more differences than there are. Sorry for the bold statements made earlier and for those wanting to use EXB in there V4 and older, you need everything except the bearings (hope I said that right). The reason I though the input pinion was a different size just occurred to me. It's not that they are a different size, but that they are built differently. I can add the EXB to my V4 set up, but the V4 input pinion doesn't work in the EXB special D ring collar. The EXB pinion is flat on both sides of the shaft and the V4 only on one. I even attempted to grind one down so I could use the collar, but decided to nix the idea in case i ruined the pinion or the collar.

And yes, the crow tastes like chicken.

 

[eyeopenher]

I didn’t see if this was answered.... but if I took a fully assembled diff and housing removed from a kraton v4, (like one you can buy from Jenny’s rc) and put the whole assembly (diff, diff housing) on the EXB, that should be fine, correct??? It won’t over gear it or under gear it or anything silly that I am not thinking of, right??? Center drive shafts are the same???
I preordered the EXB.... hoping the next shipment has the diffs sorted, but if not, just want to make sure I can do a full swap and run it like that!
Thanks in advance to you all!