Granite My First Electric- Arrma Granite 4x4

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bicketybam

bicketybam

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Arrma RC's
  1. BigRock 4x4
  2. Granite
  3. Infraction
  4. Kraton 8S
  5. Kraton 6s
  6. Kraton 4s
  7. Mojave
  8. Notorious
  9. Talion
  10. Typhon 6s
What's up, people. I am a new to electric Granite owner. All I've ever run in the past is nitro and it's been 6 years since I've run them. When I dug my stuff out of storage I was only able to get my Losi Muggy to run. Seeing that support and parts for it aren't readily available I decided to check out the electrics. The LHS recommended the Granite 4x4 so that's what I got. I was surprised by all the plastic and it was slow compared to what I was used to. I decided to go brushless and relied on the LHS to steer me in the right direction. He sold me a Castle Sidewinder 4 ESC/motor combo. The motor is a sensored 1406 4600Kv. I swapped the pinion from the stock 14t to a 17t. I changed the steering servo and picked up a 7200 2S LiPo battery.

I am a total newbie when it comes to electric. I ran the truck yesterday and it's definitely faster than stock. Is the brushless motor I put in decent? Can I run 3S with it and not tear stuff up? Everything else on the truck is stock and all the plastic makes me nervous, lol. I do enjoy the truck. More than I thought I would. I still love my Muggy but I can see more electrics in my future.

-Ed-
 
Just saw this on the Castle website, ".The 1406-4600kv motor is a great motor for 2WD short course trucks on 2s LiPo and geared conservatively. It makes a great combo for 1/10th 2WD Stadium trucks and buggies on 2s for general bashing and limited runs on 3s; temperatures will climb quickly on 3s. It makes a great upgrade for 1/10th scale on-road cars for 2s and 3s use. NOT for use in 4WD short course trucks."

That doesn't sound good for my Granite. I know it isn't a short course truck bit it sounds like I don't have an optimal motor.
 
Welcome!

Motors are somewhat personal, but I would rather have the 1410 over the 1406 (longer rotor of the 1410 = more torque). And the Mamba X over the weak BEC in the Sidewinder. That preference kind of sux for me, though because my Castle combo is on backorder, and you are driving yours... LOL Currently my Granite 4x4 is running a BLX185 on 4s. Too much power, but fun.

Be sure to check out the Mega 4x4 forum -
https://www.arrmaforum.com/forums/arrma-mega-4x4/

And the recommended upgrades thread over there -
https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/recommended-arrma-4x4-mega-upgrades.6405/
 
Jerry-rigged said:
Welcome!

Motors are somewhat personal, but I would rather have the 1410 over the 1406 (longer rotor of the 1410 = more torque). And the Mamba X over the weak BEC in the Sidewinder. That preference kind of sux for me, though because my Castle combo is on backorder, and you are driving yours... LOL Currently my Granite 4x4 is running a BLX185 on 4s. Too much power, but fun.

Be sure to check out the Mega 4x4 forum -
https://www.arrmaforum.com/forums/arrma-mega-4x4/

And the recommended upgrades thread over there -
https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/recommended-arrma-4x4-mega-upgrades.6405/
Click to expand...

Thanks, man. I've actually read through your post and got some good info. Stupid question for you: what is a BEC and what does it do?
 
I finally tightened my slipper clutch. I kept meaning to do that but kept forgetting. The truck now wheelies on command. Reminds me of my old nitro Savage!
 
bicketybam said:
So what makes one BEC better than another?
Click to expand...
Adjustability, output voltage, max output current, output ripple, and many other transient properties such as when a servo is under load causing high current draw.

Ideally a large max output current, and adjustable output voltage provides the most flexibility.
 
chazekxt46 said:
i have a new combo for sale 1410 3800 castle
Click to expand...

Is that a Mamba X combo, or a Sidewinder combo?
bicketybam said:
Thanks, man. I've actually read through your post and got some good info. Stupid question for you: what is a BEC and what does it do?
Click to expand...

To add to what Guy said, when you are comparing specs on a ESC, be sure and look at the BEC specs. The two ESC's I mention in this thread for example, the Sidewinder is a 5v, 2a non-adjustable BEC. This will make your servos slower and weaker, as a lot of servos are spec'ed or 6.0v. Also, if you put a beefy servo in your car, the 2a max may run out of power, making your car "Brownout" - that is the RX and servo lose power and you lose control of the car for a moment... The Mamba X, OTOH, is 8amps, and voltage is adjustable from 5.5 up to 8.0v. Being able to run a servo at 7.4 will greatly increase the performance (assuming it is rated for that voltage). And with 8a, you should not have any brownout issues.
 
What kind of performance gain would I get if I went 3S with my setup? Would it be worth the cost of the battery?
 
Congrats on your Granite purchase! 3S will increase your speed/power, and will also increase your heat. Check your operating temps. If you're already "close" to 200 degrees (150 and up), running 3S will push you up into the danger zone (and increase your chances of breaking stuff in your stock drivetrain).

Regarding your question about whether or not your motor is "optimal": I've always used heat as my compass. If a motor is performing well but running hot, I need more motor (if I want to maintain my speed) or different gearing (slower). I'm not very "brushless proficient," but my understanding is the higher you go in Kv on the motor, the less forgiving it is at higher voltage (3,4,6S). Lower kv motors can safely be run faster by adding bigger batteries/more power. At least I think that's how it goes...maybe one of the other more experienced members can chime in on your motor question.
 
Mentolio said:
Congrats on your Granite purchase! 3S will increase your speed/power, and will also increase your heat. Check your operating temps. If you're already "close" to 200 degrees (150 and up), running 3S will push you up into the danger zone (and increase your chances of breaking stuff in your stock drivetrain).

Regarding your question about whether or not your motor is "optimal": I've always used heat as my compass. If a motor is performing well but running hot, I need more motor (if I want to maintain my speed) or different gearing (slower). I'm not very "brushless proficient," but my understanding is the higher you go in Kv on the motor, the less forgiving it is at higher voltage (3,4,6S). Lower kv motors can safely be run faster by adding bigger batteries/more power. At least I think that's how it goes...maybe one of the other more experienced members can chime in on your motor question.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the input. I did a little internet research and found a great primer on LiPo batteries (https://rogershobbycenter.com/lipoguide/). Here is what it says about volts and a motor's Kv rating:

"The voltage of a battery pack is essentially going to determine how fast your vehicle is going to go. Voltage directly influences the RPM of the electric motor (brushless motors are rated by kV, which means 'RPM per Volt'). So if you have a brushless motor with a rating of 3,500kV, that motor will spin 3,500 RPM for every volt you apply to it. On a 2S LiPo battery, that motor will spin around 25,900 RPM. On a 3S, it will spin a whopping 38,850 RPM. So the more voltage you have, the faster you're going to go."

My motor is rated at 4600 so I am currently sitting at 34,040 RPM on 2S (7.4V). If I go to 3S (11.1V) I would be looking at 4600x11.1 for a total of 51,060 RPM. That's a huge jump and I would think that it will run super hot and things will definitely break. My ESC has a max of 3S and I think I would really be pushing my luck by going 3S.

I've given it some thought and I've decided to keep my Granite with the current setup and learn how to drive/bash it well. It's been 6 years since I stopped running Nitro and I really need to brush up on my skills. Pushing the limit while learning is only going to lead to broken parts. I went down the same road with my nitro Savage 4.6 and modded/upgraded engine/transmission beyond my ability and I was constantly breaking things. Once I feel proficient enough, I will step up to the Outcast BLX. I watched some YouTube videos on it and I definitely want one! My little Granite will be the perfect stepping stone.

Thanks again to everyone who replied an offered advice and input. Can't believe I am addicted to RC trucks all over again!

-Ed-
 
My thought is that 4600kvis a bit high for 3s running. Most folks that want to run 3s start out with a lower KV motor (around 3000kv-3500kv). Castle does rate their motors up to something like 60kRPM, so you will be within MFGR's specs. However, on the managing heat front of things, the Mega motor mount is not really flexible for gearing selection, to keep that heat under control.

And yeah, I agree with the idea of play with it as is for a while (assuming no issues with the current setup). After a few months, you will have a better idea of what really needs to change to suit your driving bashing style.
 
Jerry-rigged said:
My thought is that 4600kvis a bit high for 3s running. Most folks that want to run 3s start out with a lower KV motor (around 3000kv-3500kv). Castle does rate their motors up to something like 60kRPM, so you will be within MFGR's specs. However, on the managing heat front of things, the Mega motor mount is not really flexible for gearing selection, to keep that heat under control.

And yeah, I agree with the idea of play with it as is for a while (assuming no issues with the current setup). After a few months, you will have a better idea of what really needs to change to suit your driving bashing style.
Click to expand...

Actually the motor is rated to 100,000 RPM.

I totally relied on the LHS owner for the brushless upgrade. I told him I had a Granite and asked for an upgrade kit. He handed me the SIdewinder 4/4600Kv motor combo and I took his word for it. I probably should have done some research or at least asked him some questions. I really like the shop and the owner. I don't think he was trying to screw me. Next time I am in I will share what I learned. Thanks again!

-Ed-
 
Yeah, I don't think that combo is a bad choice, and it will probably make 95% of Traxxas owners happy. And it is kind of cheap price / decent quality, so it makes a good starter combo. Just as you dig deeper in the hobby, you will start to have your own preferences. But by then, you will know what you want, and spec your own combo.
 
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