Outcast How to improve steering range

[bfrqrv]

I am struggling a few days with the following issue, I hope someone can send me in the right direction I tried many options already.

The car is an Outcast 6S BLX (EXB) from 2021.
I bought 2 of those cars one for my daughter and one for me. Both have the same issue.

The original issue is that the steering has way too much under steer. The reason for that is the weak servo saver (non adjustable) so I did the modification you can find on internet. The modification is adding rings to the saver so the spring is more compressed, all went fine.

Now that the servo saver is stronger and no deal breaker anymore I bought a stronger servo, that's fine also.

For the horn I bought the Hot racing aluminum fixed link from USA and it fits perfectly. I also have other horn combinations but the problem is not in the connection, so all connections are fine and optimal.

Here comes the problem!

The angle range from the servo's (both stock and new) is not enough to get the full throw left and right. When I put the horn on its fine one way and not the other. When I change 1 teeth its fine the other way around. The conclusion is that the total range (degrees) from the transmitter (DX3) cannot cover the whole mechanical range the steering need.

I hope I explained it well like this. My question is there another transmitter that can bring a wider range in degrees on the servo. Then I can adjust the endpoints.
Now The endpoints are not needed because the server hardly gets to the endpoints.

 

[morrjr71]

Try a factory reset on your transmitter. I had a similar issue with another radio system (not Spektrum) where I replaced the servo and I was getting less than 50% steering throw with the new servo. I had set the endpoints on the old servo, and the transmitter was still using those endpoints on the new servo. Resetting the transmitter to factory defaults solved the issue.

 

[bfrqrv]

The transmitter is reset but the original servo's have the same issue when it comes stock out of the box. And I can adjust the endpoints fine, but the travel is just not far enough. It's maybe just 5 degrees what I need in travel.
btw its really not much but in the real world it is the difference between normal turns or very large turns. When I putt the wheels of the ground its just fine, but with a little resistance on the ground he needs that few degrees more travel. I can try to make a video of it.
In this video you see first the car with the wheels of the ground then the travel is far enough. Both sides left and right will have the maximum turn possible. In the second scene when the car is on the ground you can see one side has better force to do the same turn as of the ground and the other is missing some power because the travel is just too short.

 

[Engineer]

What's the travel range of your servo? I think most servos are around 180 degrees so that should be enough.

But basically you need to re-set your endpoints. The DX3 has a maximum range of 150% which should be more than enough to cover the full travel range of the steering: "End Point Adjustment Mode The default end point value is 100% for both steering and throttle/brake. The maximum end point value is 150% with adjustment."

 

[bfrqrv]

The servo is 180 degrees but that's only a parameter for the servo itself. The travel is limited by the code in this case from the transmitter. The endpoints I can adjust in the programming mode from the DX3 and then save it. That's the same as "re-set" I think? The endpoint adjustment does work but just to little at max output. Please remind it's rally not much I need but it's there.

the 150% what does that mean? 150% from what? This setup will never go 180 degrees of course it goes hardly 90 when I measure it, its more like 80 degrees.

But maybe I missed the "re-set"endpoints in the manual.

 

[Crunchy Gears]

The stock servo is too weak for the truck. RTRs have always come with substandard electronics.

Get yourself a ds3532 servo off of Amazon.
They're about $30 and will kick your tires wherever you need. That's what I have in mine. It comes with a servo horn too.

 

[morrjr71]

Here are the instructions for resetting a Spektrum transmitter:

Hold full left and full brake while powering the transmitter ON to put the transmitter into programming mode. The LED will flash 4 times then turns OFF to indicate factory reset. Release the wheel and throttle trigger back to neutral and the LED will illuminate to indicate factory reset is complete. Power the transmitter OFF.

 

[bfrqrv]

I think you mean DS3235 instead of DS3532? But already have that servo running! I think you didn't see the video?
No problem we will get there. I try to go in details.

When I use the horn that came with the DS3235 it will scratch the server top. There are threads on forums that acknowledging that and they buy the Hot racing aluminum fixed link so I did. It was kinda expensive to get this to my country but OK it does fit perfectly. But all the horns in the world would not solve this issue we talk about.

So my test is with the DS3235 already and with a perfect horn connection. The stock setup also has this issue also, but also the weak servo saver issue that I solved earlier. You cant get the whole travel you need to really turn the wheels at maximum both sides right and left.

Maybe you have a different car type? I can imagine that every different Arrma 6s vehicle have a different mechanical setup so that can difference the few degrees I need.

The only solution is too have some more travel in degrees then everything is perfect. I see a few options but I hope you guys can confirm.

- I didnt reset the end points? I think I have with re configuring them (5 times lol)
- I do see everything very clear and this is a bug on those vehicles (together with the weak saver) and isn't addressed yet and there is no solution?
- I know there is a servo travel tuner, I might be needing that but it would be a little strange. Also this tuner is kinda rare and not easy to get to my country.
- Mechanical solutions? I did check everything 10x and there is nothing to do except maybe the links? Are those adjustable or is it wise not to go that way? The links are fitted on a red plate with 2 wholes at each side and I have them mounted in the whole that gives the biggest throw.

update:

I did the reset from morrjr and it doesn't give the solution. I do can make both throws left and right the same but its like a compromise then. The turns will be the same but both turns are not maximum.

I try to summary the problem because I think it will become too complicated.

To say the problem in one sentence it will be this:

There is no need to set and configure the endpoints because the servo travel is a few degrees BEFORE where you would make the electronical endpoint.
I starting to think most users are dealing with this not realizing there turns are still way too big?

 

[morrjr71]

I think you mean DS3235 instead of DS3532? But already have that servo running! I think you didn't see the video?
No problem we will get there. I try to go in details.

When I use the horn that came with the DS3235 it will scratch the server top. There are threads on forums that acknowledging that and they buy the Hot racing aluminum fixed link so I did. It was kinda expensive to get this to my country but OK it does fit perfectly. But all the horns in the world would not solve this issue we talk about.

So my test is with the DS3235 already and with a perfect horn connection. The stock setup also has this issue also, but also the weak servo saver issue that I solved earlier. You cant get the whole travel you need to really turn the wheels at maximum both sides right and left.

Maybe you have a different car type? I can imagine that every different Arrma 6s vehicle have a different mechanical setup so that can difference the few degrees I need.

The only solution is too have some more travel in degrees then everything is perfect. I see a few options but I hope you guys can confirm.

- I didnt reset the end points? I think I have with re configuring them (5 times lol)
- I do see everything very clear and this is a bug on those vehicles (together with the weak saver) and isn't addressed yet and there is no solution?
- I know there is a servo travel tuner, I might be needing that but it would be a little strange. Also this tuner is kinda rare and not easy to get to my country.
- Mechanical solutions? I did check everything 10x and there is nothing to do except maybe the links? Are those adjustable or is it wise not to go that way? The links are fitted on a red plate with 2 wholes at each side and I have them mounted in the whole that gives the biggest throw.

update:

I did the reset from morrjr and it doesn't give the solution. I do can make both throws left and right the same but its like a compromise then. The turns will be the same but both turns are not maximum.

I try to summary the problem because I think it will become too complicated.

To say the problem in one sentence it will be this:

There is no need to set and configure the endpoints because the servo travel is a few degrees BEFORE where you would make the electronical endpoint.
I starting to think most users are dealing with this not realizing there turns are still way too big?

What you think is too big might be what is normal for these vehicles. I don’t “ live with it” as you say because I know what the turning radius is supposed to be. Your expectations might not meet reality.

 

[bfrqrv]

It is possible that I expect too much yes, because nothing seems to be really wrong and I did tried many things already.
But then again when we look it pure technically I also don't come too any satisfaction.
Why we have endpoints on this setup (Arrma outcast 6s/DX3) while they are not needed? I guess that's a flaw then?

 

[Exc3l]

Can u send a video where I can see the whole wheel and not just the top of the bumper? Also, it looks fine to me in the video. Undo all your endpoints and then see if that fixes the problem.

It is possible that I expect too much yes, because nothing seems to be really wrong and I did tried many things already.
But then again when we look it pure technically I also don't come too any satisfaction.
Why we have endpoints on this setup (Arrma outcast 6s/DX3) while they are not needed? I guess that's a flaw then?

End points are needed to save your servo from overstressing the servo saver bell crank and other steering components. If you don't set them you could burn and overstress your servo easily.

 

[bfrqrv]

I thought endpoints where made for not going further with the travel from the servo then the wheels can go. But in this case the wheels can go furter then the travel from the servo can. So Then I think its oke to have the endpoints on the end of the travel?

I wil make another video now I have both wheels with the same travel. Remember I am still convinced both have to go a few more degrees to have it perfect, but I agree with Morrjr that I might expecting too much from the technique here.

When we could have a few degrees more in both ways we could have a better turn (with the modded saver of course) When you have speed it really matters in the turning circle.

Is there a different transmitter that can adjust more travel then the DX3? I like to test some things to see if my wish for perfection is realistic.
I know there are travel tuners (only a few homemade I think) but all selling from USA and somewhat difficult to get here for a reasonable price. Such a travel tuner is also something I like to test with when t here is no other transmitter.

 

[Exc3l]

I see when you turn right it has more steering angle. First I would take off the servo horn turn the car on and make the servo center. Then on the controller make sure the servo steering trim is on zero. Then with the car on put the servo horn on making sure the wheels are pointing straight. Now everything will be lined up. If not use the steering trim straight. Now I want you to take off your front turn buckles and make sure they are the same length. If not they are adjustable so make them the same length. You should be good now. I think it may be your turn buckles that could be off. Use a ruler, digital callipers or something to measure them
ALSO (EDIT): Put the servo link in the middle hole not the one all they way to the right. TRY THIS FIRST

 

[bfrqrv]

Oke a couple things in response on Exc3l

1. The steering angle to right is better yes in this config because the servo has a wider travel this way. When I change the horn 1 teeth its the other way around and it's in no way adjustable through endpoints or other digital adjustments. So whe I want to max out both wheels 1 side will be always better. When I use the endpoints to have a even less travel I can get both wheels even of course.

2. The buckles are even

3. The middle horn test I had done a few hours ago and it didn't make any difference in point 1.

I think its safe too say we need more travel both ways so I can do maximum steering so we can let the digital endpoints do their job also.

 

[Monster Dork]

More travel is gained through a longer horn.

Centering is mechanical first. That means you center the servo horn how you like it, and adjust the front turnbuckles to line up right. This works every time, because you are centering the wheels to the servo's midpoint.

 

[Crunchy Gears]

I think you mean DS3235 instead of DS3532? But already have that servo running! I think you didn't see the video?
No problem we will get there. I try to go in details.

When I use the horn that came with the DS3235 it will scratch the server top. There are threads on forums that acknowledging that and they buy the Hot racing aluminum fixed link so I did. It was kinda expensive to get this to my country but OK it does fit perfectly. But all the horns in the world would not solve this issue we talk about.

So my test is with the DS3235 already and with a perfect horn connection. The stock setup also has this issue also, but also the weak servo saver issue that I solved earlier. You cant get the whole travel you need to really turn the wheels at maximum both sides right and left.

Maybe you have a different car type? I can imagine that every different Arrma 6s vehicle have a different mechanical setup so that can difference the few degrees I need.

The only solution is too have some more travel in degrees then everything is perfect. I see a few options but I hope you guys can confirm.

- I didnt reset the end points? I think I have with re configuring them (5 times lol)
- I do see everything very clear and this is a bug on those vehicles (together with the weak saver) and isn't addressed yet and there is no solution?
- I know there is a servo travel tuner, I might be needing that but it would be a little strange. Also this tuner is kinda rare and not easy to get to my country.
- Mechanical solutions? I did check everything 10x and there is nothing to do except maybe the links? Are those adjustable or is it wise not to go that way? The links are fitted on a red plate with 2 wholes at each side and I have them mounted in the whole that gives the biggest throw.

update:

I did the reset from morrjr and it doesn't give the solution. I do can make both throws left and right the same but its like a compromise then. The turns will be the same but both turns are not maximum.

I try to summary the problem because I think it will become too complicated.

To say the problem in one sentence it will be this:

There is no need to set and configure the endpoints because the servo travel is a few degrees BEFORE where you would make the electronical endpoint.
I starting to think most users are dealing with this not realizing there turns are still way too big?

Sorry yeah I did got a little dislexic with the numbers there.

I have it in an Arrma Notorious which is the exact same car minus EXB bling bits. Even with the bendy servo mount that the standard car comes with vs the aluminum one in yours, that servo cranks the wheels until they have reached the physical limit of the steering blocks no problem. I have done nothing to the servo saver as I have had no need.

I don't know what is getting scratched with the horn the servo comes with? I use it with no issues?

Is your dual rate turned all the way up? Dialing that back will decrease the maximum throw of your servo regardless of endpoint.

 

[bfrqrv]

I can try the Monster Dork option to really get the whole system line up right so we don't have any difference between left and right for starters.

And for Crunchy Maybe it's not relevant for this issue but I made a picture from the horn that came with the servo. Here you see that the angle towards the servo saver is way of when you mount it on top. On the downside of the horn there is no space then you are stuck on the servo itself. So I really think the cars are not the same? Can you make a picture from your servo/horn/saver connection just to be sure?
For new readers: This is not the problem just a sub question for Crunchy!

 

[morrjr71]

This is what the HR servo arm and horn are supposed to look like.

 

[bfrqrv]

yes thats exact what I have no problem there, I am curious about Crunchy with the standard horn that came with the new servo

 

[a2lowvw]

Because of the servo mounting height and the height of the arm on the Arrma steering linkage most servo arms don't line up correctly. The Hot Racing one works well as does the Arrma 25t one as it is high enough to put the link underneath. I have the HR servo arm and fixed link arm on 2 of my 4 6s cars with no issues hitting the physical limits of the steering. The 2 cars with them both have Savox servo's (1210sg and 1211sg) and although they are quite noisy I have had good luck with them. I would double check all the settings and maybe re-bind the transmitter with the AVC turned off and see if it helps. Make sure the AVC and SR knob is at 100% when you redo the end point adjustment.