Kraton M6s EXB and K6s EXB steering slop fixes ???

[ActionJackson]

Both my rigs have a lot of slop in the steering and I’d like to know how to tighten up their steering.

Seems to occur somewhere between the servo and steering links-to-hub attachments. I can wiggle the wheels side to side ~10-15 degrees although the servo is sitting still and not moving at all.

Any recommendations?

Thanks and Merry Christmas!

 

[cancelthefuture]

Both my rigs have a lot of slop in the steering and I’d like to know how to tighten up their steering.

Seems to occur somewhere between the servo and steering links-to-hub attachments. I can wiggle the wheels side to side ~10-15 degrees although the servo is sitting still and not moving at all.

Any recommendations?

Thanks and Merry Christmas!

Check your hubs, if the ball joints get too loose that can add slop. Don't tighten too far down, just enough that the shocks don't have any extra resistance to fight. The hubs do wear out eventually though. The servo saver spring is also pretty bad, even the 11 dollar amazon sharegoo saver is an improvement.

 

[slick2500]

Check the ackerman the stepped screws that go through the ackerman into the bell crank work loose all the time.

 

[SrC]

There is so much slop at every link throughout the whole 6s line with its steering and suspension geometry. Short of tightening the loose bits stated above etc, you will never get rid of ALL of it.
I'm at a point however with all my 6s rigs, that all I do is stay with the stock parts throughout, and at every ball link, I insert Teflon Tape into the Ends, then pop the ball back on. This gets rid of most of it. But some will always be there. Upgrade parts or not. Hubs/ BB's have much slop as well. I shim the outer BB's to improve that some. I am more critical about my On road rigs. For bashing Off road, it doesn't matter much.

 

[slick2500]

There is so much slop at every link throughout the whole 6s line with its steering and suspension geometry. Short of tightening the loose bits stated above etc, you will never get rid of ALL of it.
I'm at a point however with all my 6s rigs, that all I do is stay with the stock parts throughout, and at every ball link, I insert Teflon Tape into the Ends, then pop the ball back on. This gets rid of most of it. But some will always be there. Upgrade parts or not. Hubs/ BB's have much slop as well. I shim the outer BB's to improve that some. I am more critical about my On road rigs. For bashing Off road, it doesn't matter much.

I find that 90% or the slop comes from the Ackerman and the upper a arms.

 

[SrC]

Agree,
and with wear at the upper arms, it always gets worse. As basher rigs, I just replace them when the the upper arms break. When I raced at the track , I would replace the arms, from wear alone. But they were nice and tight when you installed them as new parts. I found best advantage with the RPM arms were its fit. Little if any slop. Just too flexi for me. I always felt Arms should always be stiff. These are Arrma's built for their purpose, Precision is not the goal here. I never really noticed much slop from my Ackerman (center link) when I rebuild them. But it is a critical part that is not clearly visible, under the ST top plate, short of disassembly. Often overlooked. They can surely loosen up. The screws need a drop of TL when you install the 2 Pivot "Step" Bushings. The M3 Nylock back nuts alone don't cut it. I might smear a drop of Dry lube on the step bushings before assembly for moral support. Best ackermans are hardened alloy. The cheap stocker Ackermans are soft metal and wear out at the step bushings eventually.

 

[slick2500]

Agree,
and with wear at the upper arms, it always gets worse. As basher rigs, I just replace them when the the upper arms break. When I raced at the track , I would replace the arms, from wear alone. But they were nice and tight when you installed them as new parts. I found best advantage with the RPM arms were its fit. Little if any slop. Just too flexi for me. I always felt Arms should always be stiff. These are Arrma's built for their purpose, Precision is not the goal here. I never really noticed much slop from my Ackerman (center link) when I rebuild them. But it is a critical part that is not clearly visible, under the ST top plate, short of disassembly. Often overlooked. They can surely loosen up. The screws need a drop of TL when you install the 2 Pivot "Step" Bushings. The M3 Nylock back nuts alone don't cut it. I might smear a drop of Dry lube on the step bushings before assembly for moral support. Best ackermans are hardened alloy. The cheap stocker Ackermans are soft metal and wear out at the step bushings eventually.

New arms, Rpm arms didn't matter the slop is still there and still way too much. I've bent every single stock ackerman on every single 6s Arrma even the EXB. Even with the M2C ackerman there is still slop in the akerman do to the bushings used.

 

[SrC]

There is no 100% effective solution.
Or just get a Tekno something.
Not a fan of RPM Nylon Arms with the 6s line. For some brands, mostly the smaller 1/10 scale stuff, RPM Nylon is better. And upgrade alloy arms are not the answer.

 

[slick2500]

There is no 100% effective solution.
Or just get a Tekno something.
Not a fan of RPM Nylon Arms with the 6s line. For some brands, mostly the smaller 1/10 scale stuff, RPM Nylon is better. And upgrade alloy arms are not the answer.

It's not about being 100% it's about not being so sloppy with all new parts that you still cannot properly set the toe. All my Arrmas are just eyeballed because it changes so much depending on how the car is sitting.

 

[SrC]

Yeah all the slop prevents you from even finding/measuring the actual toe and camber, let alone setting it where you want it. It never stays fixed. I eyeball it now as well. That's as good as it will get anyway. That slop is always like many degrees off. Pos-Neg. Camber, Toe and all. No matter where you set it. Close enough is good enough. You just need the rig to drive straight and tires wear evenly well enough.
>>I still say using Teflon tape in every single ball end can reduce a lot of that slop. What percentage of it , Cant say. At least there is a way to tighten the ball ends up. No reason for Ball ends needing to be sloppy out the box.
Just how Arrma's are for some reason.
>>The T. tape trick I've done since my track days, as the ball ends wear out. It was a Pro Racer hack.

 

[parcou]

Both my rigs have a lot of slop in the steering and I’d like to know how to tighten up their steering.

Seems to occur somewhere between the servo and steering links-to-hub attachments. I can wiggle the wheels side to side ~10-15 degrees although the servo is sitting still and not moving at all.

Any recommendations?

Thanks and Merry Christmas!

Looks like good advice...

So many places to start. The Ackerman is a great place to start, steering bearing over bushing. I also found the stock Ackerman bar (bar in the middle that joins each side) lots of slop when replaced with a basher queen carbon fiber far better. From there, slop in the upper arms using shims to tighten it.

 

[PrerunninF150]

I find that 90% or the slop comes from the Ackerman and the upper a arms.

I was just gonna bring this up today. Is the only solution to just swap out the upper arms periodically from wear and tear?

 

[slick2500]

I was just gonna bring this up today. Is the only solution to just swap out the upper arms periodically from wear and tear?

I just live with it to be honest. I try to add some more spacers in the arms to shim as much of the fore and aft play as possible without them binding.

 

[PrerunninF150]

I just live with it to be honest. I try to add some more spacers in the arms to shim as much of the fore and aft play as possible without them binding.

Bummer. I have them shimmed up real good but still get massive deflection at the pivot ball. Has anyone ever tried drilling them out and inserting a small sleeve to pivot on somewhat like I believe Tekno does on some pivots?

 

[slick2500]

Bummer. I have them shimmed up real good but still get massive deflection at the pivot ball. Has anyone ever tried drilling them out and inserting a small sleeve to pivot on somewhat like I believe Tekno does on some pivots?

I've though about doing that, but I don't think there is enough material to not compromise the integrity of the arms.

 

[332_RC]

Looks like good advice...

So many places to start. The Ackerman is a great place to start, steering bearing over bushing. I also found the stock Ackerman bar (bar in the middle that joins each side) lots of slop when replaced with a basher queen carbon fiber far better. From there, slop in the upper arms using shims to tighten it.

So the BQ CF Ackerman is way better & removed some or all of slop? I bent the stock one on my K6 & flattened it back out but it needs replacing. I have a EXB on my Notorious & it's ok, some slop there. Seems CF is the move?

 

[SrC]

I just live with it to be honest. I try to add some more spacers in the arms to shim as much of the fore and aft play as possible without them binding.

Been there also. Additional Caster shimming won't address the Arm and Hinge pin's poor fit inside within arm. The arms hinge pin "shaft" is just poorly molded. Oversized. That's where the main Slop issue comes from. Fore and Aft caster movement can be shimmed with some success, but not the perfect one solution. And Over shimming in this area to compensate, will just Bind up the upper arm. Been there. I have considered using something to lightly fill, coating the Arms inner shaft, a glue, epoxy or similar. Let cure, then ream it out with a Reamer tool, to match the O.D. of that upper hinge pin. I wont get that crazy with it however. I'm sure it can be done. And probably been done by someone already.
The Fr lower Arms and Rears also have this same slop. Not just the front Upper arms. And with an On road 6s platform with speed running for instance, I feel the rear arm's fit is more critical. This affects the Rear Toe, getting all sloppy. Affecting directional stability more so at high speeds. Getting all Squirelly under load. How I see it.

 

[KnowAir]

I just learned to live with the slop.. I feel that Arrma could do better, but aside from replacing arms, hubs, bushings and end links on a routine basis..not much we as end users can do about it.
I will give TRX some credit, IDK if it's the plastics they use or what, but seem to stay tighter for longer than my Arrma's. At least in bigger scale (1/8 and 1/6) rigs, the 1/10 not so much.

 

[332_RC]

I found these McMaster Carr 95630A438 PTFE shims for my K6. They are 1mm thick each & really slick. These are RPM arms. I put 1 at back 3 in front & it's perfect. No slop & super smooth, no bind w the shocks off. The rear mount is the screw type & stock upper pins.

 

[KnowAir]

I found these McMaster Carr 95630A438 PTFE shims for my K6. They are 1mm thick each & really slick. These are RPM arms. I put 1 at back 3 in front & it's perfect. No slop & super smooth, no bind w the shocks off. The rear mount is the screw type & stock upper pins.

View attachment 339123

View attachment 339124

View attachment 339125

Yeah, that'll definitely get rid of the fore and aft movement of the arm, unfortunately, it won't do anything for how sloppy the arms are on the hinge pins. Which is what the real problem is for me.. my brand new K8S is downright disgusting how much slop there is at the front upper arms.. no shims will help, it's the poor fitment between the pins and arms. Have a look at this RR hinge pin/plate fitment..this is a brand new rig with maybe 2 packs through it. I'm referring to the gap between the aluminum D block and hinge pins..this is poor quality IMO.