Kraton Updated: Arrma Kraton / Outcast 4s

[slick2500]

Why

You can still get most of the V1 4s parts right?

I’m not sure if they consider this a mild refresh or a whole new generation. I guess the former.

I’m sure if they called it a V3 a bunch of fanboys would complain that it’s not really new.

I feel like they changed enough to warrant a new version number. I mean it has an entirely different chassis, a center diff, a different servo and a different esc.

 

[J.Rambo]

Totally agree, it's been a great year for Arrma and us as their customers. And if they dropped a 3s Granite with a center diff, I'd 100% buy one, even if it's not "new".

I dropped one into my v2 Granite! Drives like a dream! What a difference!

 

[Surchaufeur]

You can still get most of the V1 4s parts right?


I feel like they changed enough to warrant a new version number. I mean it has an entirely different chassis, a center diff, a different servo and a different esc.

Chassis was just changed to make the cuts and mounts for the center diff. They claim they revised the hinge pin area. I wonder what that means theres nothing obvioua

I dropped one into my v2 Granite! Drives like a dream! What a difference!

Might get a granite and get the Old orange body and the center diff. But my lipos wont fit anymore with the center diff is 144mm

 

[lee82gx]

Just realized that the center diff is ALL metal. It is all round a better design than the darned diffs in 6s vehicles up to 2023. Sealing the 2 metal diff cases with a single gasket - who would've thought of that. 6s ones come with plastic center diffs that will literally melt, or at least deform and lose the seal. They could've reused the F/R plastic ones but instead chose the right way. Good on them. Surely less diff explosion stories with the 4s line.

 

[RCbuzz]

Just realized that the center diff is ALL metal. It is all round a better design than the darned diffs in 6s vehicles up to 2023. Sealing the 2 metal diff cases with a single gasket - who would've thought of that. 6s ones come with plastic center diffs that will literally melt, or at least deform and lose the seal. They could've reused the F/R plastic ones but instead chose the right way. Good on them. Surely less diff explosion stories with the 4s line.

I agree with you that it would be really nice if the 6s line came with a metal diff case stock, but, keep in mind that 4s diff is sintered metal, the 6s diff comes with a steel (hardened?) spur and still has a stronger design using dog bones to the diff's.

I find thicker fluids work well on the 6S and if full seems to cut down on incident rates.

Time will tell.

 

[lee82gx]

I agree with you that it would be really nice if the 6s line came with a metal diff case stock, but, keep in mind that 4s diff is sintered metal, the 6s diff comes with a steel (hardened?) spur and still has a stronger design using dog bones to the diff's.

I find thicker fluids work well on the 6S and if full seems to cut down on incident rates.

Time will tell.

I hope you are right on the thicker fluids...many of us have had to quickly change to 500k cst and above, and the work to maintain and swap to even higher viscosity is both tedious and too late if it doesn't work.

Why do you say splined drive shaft connectors are stronger than dog bones? Just curious. In my mind, you can hardly end up with a notched or worn spline connection but the dogbones and drive cups are surely going to end up notched as the contact surface is always limited to small patch.

Haven't actually seen or touched the 4s diff, it doesn't appear clear whether sintered or die cast. I'd still prefer either compared to plastic. If only for the heat capabilities. The spur of the 6s is indeed very strong material, as I recently chewed the factory pinion AND another cheap chinesium pinion with not so much as a scratch on the spur itself.

 

[MrLimey]

Chassis was just changed to make the cuts and mounts for the center diff. They claim they revised the hinge pin area. I wonder what that means theres nothing obvioua

Might get a granite and get the Old orange body and the center diff. But my lipos wont fit anymore with the center diff is 144mm

Here is a side by side of old and new chassis that someone else posted on a Facebook group. Looks like the extra ribbing at the front hinge area is designed to stiffen it up and flex less so the pins don’t pop out. Also, strengthen the weak point where the chassis narrows to become the diff/bulkhead as lots of people are snapping the front end clean off.

I don’t see any revisions to the chassis to stiffen up the tub and prevent the flex that causes the motor to punch thru the bottom, which is bad: the current offerings for chassis braces don’t look like they will work on this new chassis as the bump on the bottom below the diff or slipper is larger. And the exploded parts diagram implies this is the only chassis going forward as it’s backwards compatible. It’s possible removing the swat bars helped I guess. On an uneven landing they are going to push opposing wheels to the ones that contact first up, and delay the cushioning of all 4 shocks coming in to effect but that’s just a theory.

There is already a red 25T servo saver so I would be surprised if this black 25T doesn’t have a stiffer spring to address the fact the current 23T is too weak. Especially as the servo is now more powerful and that power is pointless without a stiffer saver

Battery strap clips are nice but the old ones worked ok mostly. Arrma just never included directions of how they are supposed to function so people were clipping in the wires after securing the straps instead of before and running strap over top.

I hate the composite pivot balls with a vengeance so it’s disappointing Arrma can’t do something as simple as changing them to stainless steel. They have such a rough surface it’s like sandpaper in the links and everything gets loose in short order and ruins the whole experience.

 

[RCbuzz]

I hope you are right on the thicker fluids...many of us have had to quickly change to 500k cst and above, and the work to maintain and swap to even higher viscosity is both tedious and too late if it doesn't work.

Why do you say splined drive shaft connectors are stronger than dog bones? Just curious. In my mind, you can hardly end up with a notched or worn spline connection but the dogbones and drive cups are surely going to end up notched as the contact surface is always limited to small patch.

Haven't actually seen or touched the 4s diff, it doesn't appear clear whether sintered or die cast. I'd still prefer either compared to plastic. If only for the heat capabilities. The spur of the 6s is indeed very strong material, as I recently chewed the factory pinion AND another cheap chinesium pinion with not so much as a scratch on the spur itself.

I feel your pain, nothing like having to disassemble your new RC before running it, @SrC and many others have mentioned before though its just part of routine for a lot of RTR's. I will say, I did not pull my Hoss apart when I got it, just charged a pack and ran it! Kind of the luck of the draw, sometimes they come almost 100%! In the case of my Fireteam... ..

For the application being used I was mentioning that (my opinion) the steel dog bone center shaft design is better than the splined shaft connections. If you search the forum you will find many examples of the aluminum spline on the 3s/4s rigs wearing down to nothing.

There are also a lot of them that cracked or chunked out (I had one crack too). I believe the main reason for this is that the spline connections are 1. aluminum/pot metal? and 2. don't allow for flex when the chassis deflects. Since the spline cannot operate at an angle like the dog bone (or cvd) setups they just break or wear down.

 

[KnowAir]

Only way to do it is to keep making videos saying they're overpriced, and have people look at alternatives.

At the rate Arrma is going, I may never even look at another TRX vehicle purchase, LOL. Arrma is putting out such a better value product.

 

[slick2500]

I feel your pain, nothing like having to disassemble your new RC before running it, @SrC and many others have mentioned before though its just part of routine for a lot of RTR's. I will say, I did not pull my Hoss apart when I got it, just charged a pack and ran it! Kind of the luck of the draw, sometimes they come almost 100%! In the case of my Fireteam... ..

For the application being used I was mentioning that (my opinion) the steel dog bone center shaft design is better than the splined shaft connections. If you search the forum you will find many examples of the aluminum spline on the 3s/4s rigs wearing down to nothing.

There are also a lot of them that cracked or chunked out (I had one crack too). I believe the main reason for this is that the spline connections are 1. aluminum/pot metal? and 2. don't allow for flex when the chassis deflects. Since the spline cannot operate at an angle like the dog bone (or cvd) setups they just break or wear down.

Cracked slipper hubs is an extremely common occurrence. Pot metal in that area was probably not the best idea.

 

[Hoodies&Hondas]

So both the Kraton and Outcast have the same internals, correct? Meaning if you’re choosing one over the other, it’s just for sake of aesthetic preference? Or are there differences that I’m missing?

 

[RCbuzz]

So both the Kraton and Outcast have the same internals, correct? Meaning if you’re choosing one over the other, it’s just for sake of aesthetic preference? Or are there differences that I’m missing?

The Kraton is longer than the Outcast and has different tires, wheels, and body. Otherwise, they have always been pretty much siblings throughout the different lineups.

 

[KnowAir]

So both the Kraton and Outcast have the same internals, correct? Meaning if you’re choosing one over the other, it’s just for sake of aesthetic preference? Or are there differences that I’m missing?

Outcast is the stunt truck (devil), Kraton is the "speed" basher.. the wheelbase is the most significant difference, Outcast is a wheelie machine, Kraton rarely wheelies without a bump to get it up. Unless of course you add more power, then they wheelie on command.

 

[Hoodies&Hondas]

Thanks, guys. Sounds like the Kraton is more up my alley then.

 

[Surchaufeur]

Here is a side by side of old and new chassis that someone else posted on a Facebook group. Looks like the extra ribbing at the front hinge area is designed to stiffen it up and flex less so the pins don’t pop out. Also, strengthen the weak point where the chassis narrows to become the diff/bulkhead as lots of people are snapping the front end clean off.

I don’t see any revisions to the chassis to stiffen up the tub and prevent the flex that causes the motor to punch thru the bottom, which is bad: the current offerings for chassis braces don’t look like they will work on this new chassis as the bump on the bottom below the diff or slipper is larger. And the exploded parts diagram implies this is the only chassis going forward as it’s backwards compatible. It’s possible removing the swat bars helped I guess. On an uneven landing they are going to push opposing wheels to the ones that contact first up, and delay the cushioning of all 4 shocks coming in to effect but that’s just a theory.

There is already a red 25T servo saver so I would be surprised if this black 25T doesn’t have a stiffer spring to address the fact the current 23T is too weak. Especially as the servo is now more powerful and that power is pointless without a stiffer saver

Battery strap clips are nice but the old ones worked ok mostly. Arrma just never included directions of how they are supposed to function so people were clipping in the wires after securing the straps instead of before and running strap over top.

I hate the composite pivot balls with a vengeance so it’s disappointing Arrma can’t do something as simple as changing them to stainless steel. They have such a rough surface it’s like sandpaper in the links and everything gets loose in short order and ruins the whole experience.

View attachment 334857

They didnt really fix the weak point being the upper area on the hinge pin. I remedied the issue with a 7075 hinge pin brace and longer pins 63.5mm straight cut pins. They go trought the hinge pin brace and into the skid. The skid has a little slot and it like if it was meant to be for those pins. I used spacer and my rotary tool to cut a bit of the radiobox and i shoved a losi LMT servo saver in. Not messing with those crappy direct mounts again. The v2 velcro were kinda stupid by design. Prefer the v1. My lipos are 155mm long mostly flat packs so the new velcro system berely secured my lipos in and they would detach under heavy landing
And i have team asociated shoulder balls

 

[slick2500]

Outcast is the stunt truck (devil), Kraton is the "speed" basher.. the wheelbase is the most significant difference, Outcast is a wheelie machine, Kraton rarely wheelies without a bump to get it up. Unless of course you add more power, then they wheelie on command.

My Kraton EXB with the Hobbywing Max6 4985 1650kv combo does standing backflips, the 6s rtr struggles to wheelie on the stock gearing.

 

[KnowAir]

My Kraton EXB with the Hobbywing Max6 4985 1650kv combo does standing backflips, the 6s rtr struggles to wheelie on the stock gearing.

Agreed. I was just trying to explain the fundamental difference between the Outcast and Kraton.

 

[slick2500]

Agreed. I was just trying to explain the fundamental difference between the Outcast and Kraton.

I was just giving an example to add to what you were saying. I forgot to mention the Outcast 6s can wheelie all day long on 4s.

 

[cazrack]

529.95 for the Rustler Ultimate seems far off compared to this new one. Traxxas need to rethink their pricing on everything below the Maxx.
Many old design models with high price compared to Arrma and the China RC's are getting better on the cheap side for example the new https://www.amazon.com/HAIBOXING-2997A-Brushless-Independent-Applicable/dp/B0CKBRTZ4L

With a center diff.

 

[305HemiGuy]

529.95 for the Rustler Ultimate seems far off compared to this new one. Traxxas need to rethink their pricing on everything below the Maxx.
Many old design models with high price compared to Arrma and the China RC's are getting better on the cheap side for example the new https://www.amazon.com/HAIBOXING-2997A-Brushless-Independent-Applicable/dp/B0CKBRTZ4L

With a center diff.

In the very near future, Traxxas will be FORCED to bring their prices down. Too much competitively priced competition out there for them not to.