Infraction data log help

[sleekone]

first time using the Castle Link so not really sure what im looking at. i tried to get a baseline run today and see what the graphs look like - i made 3 passes: 112mph, 114mph, 114mph.
running the following in the Limitless
MMX8S
1717 motor +dual NTF fans
34S/35P gearing
2x 8000mAh gens-ace-r-spam 80C
18,800 uF cap pack
(i posted this as Infraction b/c there is no Limitless prefix i guess?)
any help from the data log gurus would be appreciated - i know you guys are out there! (@LibertyMKiii i'm looking at you )

 

[Malice]

First, go to edit and change your gearing,kv,and number of poles. Enter your pinion size and spur size. Change your pole count to 4 and enter 1650kv. Then begin going through the data.

Check out this post also: https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/castle-data-log-interpretation-help.27239/

 

[sleekone]

First, go to edit and change your gearing,kv,and number of poles. Enter your pinion size and spur size. Change your pole count to 4 and enter 1650kv. Then begin going through the data.

Check out this post also: https://www.arrmaforum.com/threads/castle-data-log-interpretation-help.27239/

thanks. i made the changes and also separated the session so it's a little clearer..I'll check out that link too.

 

[jondilly1974]

thanks. i made the changes and also separated the session so it's a little clearer..I'll check out that link too.
View attachment 99766

Looks good. Seems like you might have had some more throttle to give it. Says max was 97%. RPMs were only 32k by that data. Seems you have more to give it. Did you run out of room?

 

[sleekone]

Looks good. Seems like you might have had some more throttle to give it. Says max was 97%. RPMs were only 32k by that data. Seems you have more to give it. Did you run out of room?

I’ve got a pretty nice long street with no traffic. I had the throttle pinned at midway point. My PB with this set up so far is 120mph, which I think is pretty good still, but feel like I should be able to squeeze more out of this setup.
i guess my questions would be what do you guys see in the data log graph that may be indicative of something holding me back..?

if I’m running max from this setup then I’d start looking at other things to change to improve my PB...
- aerodynamics, cut front and rear wings?
- better batteries like SMC are an option, would they make that much of a difference?
- next thought is change spur to 29T and gear down pinion back to 27-29 and start gearing up again
I definitely hear the chassis scraping so I’m gonna play with the suspension. I’ve already changed out to the stiffer springs.

any other recommendations..?
Max rpm for the 1717 is 56,000 so I’m not even close it looks like. How do I get there??

 

[Malice]

Recalibrate your transmitter and esc after making sure your throttle endpoints are at 100%.

 

[jondilly1974]

I’ve got a pretty nice long street with no traffic. I had the throttle pinned at midway point. My PB with this set up so far is 120mph, which I think is pretty good still, but feel like I should be able to squeeze more out of this setup.
i guess my questions would be what do you guys see in the data log graph that may be indicative of something holding me back..?

if I’m running max from this setup then I’d start looking at other things to change to improve my PB...
- aerodynamics, cut front and rear wings?
- better batteries like SMC are an option, would they make that much of a difference?
- next thought is change spur to 29T and gear down pinion back to 27-29 and start gearing up again
I definitely hear the chassis scraping so I’m gonna play with the suspension. I’ve already changed out to the stiffer springs.

any other recommendations..?
Max rpm for the 1717 is 56,000 so I’m not even close it looks like. How do I get there??

Recalibrate your transmitter and esc after making sure your throttle endpoints are at 100%.

This ☝?☝?

You’re not getting 100% from the radio. Turn on the ESC first, holding full throttle on, turn on the transmitter and then wait for the red flash and go full reverse, wait for the yellow, let go of the trigger (neutral) and then it should do the startup chimes again and you’re good to go.

I’m not a fan of SMC lipos. The ones I’ve owned have puffed up. I prefer the Turnigy Graphene Panther for speed runs.

 

[sleekone]

This ☝?☝?

You’re not getting 100% from the radio. Turn on the ESC first, holding full throttle on, turn on the transmitter and then wait for the red flash and go full reverse, wait for the yellow, let go of the trigger (neutral) and then it should do the startup chimes again and you’re good to go.

I’m not a fan of SMC lipos. The ones I’ve owned have puffed up. I prefer the Turnigy Graphene Panther for speed runs.

I’ll recalibrate, re-run, and post results tomorrow. ??

 

[Mr.Duke]

Drop 5 teeth on the pinion
Activate your throttle input on the data log and stay wot for about 3 seconds

I think you’ll be surprised at the results

 

[KiTris ExtremeRC]

I’ve got a pretty nice long street with no traffic. I had the throttle pinned at midway point. My PB with this set up so far is 120mph, which I think is pretty good still, but feel like I should be able to squeeze more out of this setup.
i guess my questions would be what do you guys see in the data log graph that may be indicative of something holding me back..?

if I’m running max from this setup then I’d start looking at other things to change to improve my PB...
- aerodynamics, cut front and rear wings?
- better batteries like SMC are an option, would they make that much of a difference?
- next thought is change spur to 29T and gear down pinion back to 27-29 and start gearing up again
I definitely hear the chassis scraping so I’m gonna play with the suspension. I’ve already changed out to the stiffer springs.

any other recommendations..?
Max rpm for the 1717 is 56,000 so I’m not even close it looks like. How do I get there??

I'm not 100% sure on this but I had some really low RPMs myself and that was because I put in the gearing ratio. If I just put in the KV and poles of the motor I get a more sensible RPM reading. I had a speed run where I went 110mph and the RPM would say that I went around 70mph. Once I removed the gearing ratio I had more or less the same speed as my GPS.

 

[sleekone]

Drop 5 teeth on the pinion
Activate your throttle input on the data log and stay wot for about 3 seconds

I think you’ll be surprised at the results

you think i'm overgeared? i was thinking that too maybe. current PB is 120mph with 35/34 gearing on this set up...i started with a 29T and jumped to 35T once i got it running straight and over 100mph consistently . I'll try what you suggest and go down to 30T and check the logs etc again. thanks!

I’m not a fan of SMC lipos. The ones I’ve owned have puffed up. I prefer the Turnigy Graphene Panther for speed runs.

These gens-ace-r-spam are 8000mAh 80C but only have 12g wires...you think any chance that's playing into being restrictive also? on my log i see I'm maxing out at 360amps so i think ive got good power flowing through the wiring and connections everywhere...but again im not sure what a really great speed run log would look like..
Thinking of re-wiring with some wiring harnesses to clean it up a bit..would this work..? Should I consider running the lipos in parallel, using xt150s?

Also at work and don’t wanna do much of anything on a Monday so there’s that too ?

 

[LibertyMKiii]

you think i'm overgeared? i was thinking that too maybe. current PB is 120mph with 35/34 gearing on this set up...i started with a 29T and jumped to 35T once i got it running straight and over 100mph consistently . I'll try what you suggest and go down to 30T and check the logs etc again. thanks!


These gens-ace-r-spam are 8000mAh 80C but only have 12g wires...you think any chance that's playing into being restrictive also? on my log i see I'm maxing out at 360amps so i think ive got good power flowing through the wiring and connections everywhere...but again im not sure what a really great speed run log would look like..
Thinking of re-wiring with some wiring harnesses to clean it up a bit..would this work..? Should I consider running the lipos in parallel, using xt150s?
View attachment 99833
Also at work and don’t wanna do much of anything on a Monday so there’s that too ?

You could gear way up and possibly see more amps and heat. Or you could gear down and get more RPMs and see more amps also. I would try reducing the pinion and see what happens. Ideally I would want to see a zoomed in section of a "best run" What I look for is if the RPMs are rapidly increasing. This would tell me that you are still accelerating and need to run a longer distance. If it is not rapidly increasing RPMs then you likely have over geared as you should be approaching 42k rpms on 8s (considering voltage drop).

 

[sleekone]

You could gear way up and possibly see more amps and heat. Or you could gear down and get more RPMs and see more amps also. I would try reducing the pinion and see what happens. Ideally I would want to see a zoomed in section of a "best run" What I look for is if the RPMs are rapidly increasing. This would tell me that you are still accelerating and need to run a longer distance. If it is not rapidly increasing RPMs then you likely have over geared as you should be approaching 42k rpms on 8s (considering voltage drop).

interesting. ok i assume i can zoom in on the graph somehow - i'll figure that part out and re-run and re-post a run before i gear down. i want to try and trouble shoot as best I can before changing a bunch of things and not really knowing what affects what. thanks for all your guys' help!

(ugh but now i'm still stuck at work for the next 8 hours! ? )

 

[jondilly1974]

you think i'm overgeared? i was thinking that too maybe. current PB is 120mph with 35/34 gearing on this set up...i started with a 29T and jumped to 35T once i got it running straight and over 100mph consistently . I'll try what you suggest and go down to 30T and check the logs etc again. thanks!


These gens-ace-r-spam are 8000mAh 80C but only have 12g wires...you think any chance that's playing into being restrictive also? on my log i see I'm maxing out at 360amps so i think ive got good power flowing through the wiring and connections everywhere...but again im not sure what a really great speed run log would look like..
Thinking of re-wiring with some wiring harnesses to clean it up a bit..would this work..? Should I consider running the lipos in parallel, using xt150s?
View attachment 99833
Also at work and don’t wanna do much of anything on a Monday so there’s that too ?

With the amps you’re getting and the voltage drop (~7v) I would think some better lipos, a smoother pull, lower gearing, or a longer road is needed. Something along the way is pulling your voltage down and it’s hard to be definitive from the data we have.

 

[LibertyMKiii]

With the amps you’re getting and the voltage drop (~7v) I would think some better lipos, a smoother pull, lower gearing, or a longer road is needed. Something along the way is pulling your voltage down and it’s hard to be definitive from the data we have.

I have never done 8s with Turnigy Panthers, what sort of voltage drop are you seeing on your cars Jon?
I did run the CNHL 6000 mAh packs on the Typhon with the MMX8s and BLX 2050kv motor and it dropped down to 27.7V

 

[jondilly1974]

I have never done 8s with Turnigy Panthers, what sort of voltage drop are you seeing on your cars Jon?
I did run the CNHL 6000 mAh packs on the Typhon with the MMX8s and BLX 2050kv motor and it dropped down to 27.7V

I just went back and looked at my 137mph log and saw my drop was 8v @ 397A. This was the MMX8S with the Spektrum 1250kv on 44/29 gearing using 2x TGP 4S 5.0 and a Ripple Killer. Max ripple was 2.75v.

 

[LibertyMKiii]

I just went back and looked at my 137mph log and saw my drop was 8v @ 397A. This was the MMX8S with the Spektrum 1250kv on 44/29 gearing using 2x TGP 4S 5.0 and a Ripple Killer. Max ripple was 2.75v.

To add some more data to this thread. Again my Typhon using a streamliner body. The GPS picked up 119mph but I honestly believe it was north of 130mph. You can see the RPMS were ramping up really fast. With the known 2-3 second delay on the Garmin GPS is suspect it was a delayed speed reading.

Anyway this was MMX8s Arrma 2050kv 6s motor on 8s with 2 CNHL 70c 4s packs 6000mAh. Interestingly the voltage drop was less than the Turnigy Panthers. (although the extra 1000 mAh helps... I cannot remember exactly but I believe this was 34 spur and 29t pinion. It seemed to be the sweet spot for this motor. I bet it had 140 in it with a longer road. I didn't have the power output column turned on but this was 94% throttle.

 

[jkflow]

Thinking of re-wiring with some wiring harnesses to clean it up a bit..would this work..? Should I consider running the lipos in parallel, using xt150s?
View attachment 99833
Also at work and don’t wanna do much of anything on a Monday so there’s that too ?

If those are supposed to be connectors, you have to remove all of them except the Lipo connection. Cap pack as close as possible (electrically) to the ESC for it to have any meaningful impact. With the setup above you will have excessive voltage drops across your connections.

 

[sleekone]

If those are supposed to be connectors, you have to remove all of them except the Lipo connection. Cap pack as close as possible (electrically) to the ESC for it to have any meaningful impact. With the setup above you will have excessive voltage drops across your connections.

even with high quality connectors like castle 6.5s? its only 2 more connectors than im running now and not seeing excessive voltage drop i don't think...but maybe i am.. what do you consider'excessive'?
it would also allow me to switch out battery set ups to run xt150s paralell or 6.5s in series or switch cap packs etc quickly and less 3 way soldering...

 

[LibertyMKiii]

even with high quality connectors like castle 6.5s? its only 2 more connectors than im running now and not seeing excessive voltage drop i don't think...but maybe i am.. what do you consider'excessive'?
it would also allow me to switch out battery set ups to run xt150s paralell or 6.5s in series or switch cap packs etc quickly and less 3 way soldering...

Your ripple voltage is at 1.2V so the caps are doing what they should just fine.
I do like to avoid connectors as much as possible. Ideally one to the cap pack should be close to the ESC and I like having a connector on it so it can be removed during repairs. You would of course need a harness to make the series connection to the LiPos. The only big change from your drawing I would say is to remove the first connector and make sure the caps are close to the ESC

6.5 castle connectors should be fine. I know a guy doing 149mph with a 4tec 2.0 using XT90 connectors LOL


When talking about Amps and voltage remember that your gearing and the "mechanical and aerodynamic Load" on the car is what creates the demand for amps from the system. It does not originate with the batteries. They simply try to keep up with the demand.
The higher your Amps the lower the volts will dip.

I'd reduce your gearing slightly and make no other changes. Then test again. If you change 2-3 things you won't know which helped.